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Very good atricle here in TmeSounds like I need to move to SLC. I think there is some truth in this. But instead general priesthood meeting tends to pound the same topics – the ones of “you must do better” that drives away young men. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
LH wrote Quote:But instead general priesthood meeting tends to pound the same topics – the ones of “you must do better” that drives away young men.
My 25 year old daughter gets so angry at those talks and articles. She is a very independent, single woman and is sick to death about how many talks diminish guys.
I am sure I will be ready to marry an LDS girl/woman once I get rid of all baggage or problems that could cause any pain, so she won’t have to put up with it. One can’t bring one’s failures and past mistakes into the relationship, now can we? Better that I remain single until the problem is fixed than hurt someone, seeing how you only get one chance at Eternal Marriage. Constantly hearing a message about how one is not worthy, based on one’s life actions/past history and despite any attempted changes, to marry any of these LDS Girls/Women does not encourage one to date these women since you don’t fit the needed Peter Priesthood paradigm. Why go after people who you know want you and whom you would only hurt for being you? What is the point? It feels better to date those outside the church, since one is closer in terms of equal value there.
That was a depressing read. It reminded me about a comment Claudia Bushman made towards the end of her recent fMh Year of Polygamy interview with Lindsay Park. They were talking about options women had back then, what the future might hold, etc., and Sis. Bushman (I love how she just throws things out to see what sticks) said she wants to see self-sufficient “female colonies” – nunneries. :wtf: Where the article lost me was the BYU numbers. How they say the ratio is more men than women at BYU, but then they focus on the freshman class, which has a 62:38 ratio for men to women. Older men will date younger women, but the reverse is less likely. So, I’m not sure the crisis is as bad at BYU as they say. I felt that part was massaging the perspective on the numbers to shore up the idea there is a crisis. Further, I would have liked to have seen statistics on the gender ratio for people in the 18 to 28 bracket laid out for clearer analysis. Not sure if the article expressed a comparison of the gender ratio in the general population compared to the gender ratio on the Mormon population, by age category either. These would provide clearer analysis. Nonetheless, my experience was that even being a handsome, well-educated, articulate male with a bright career future made it hard to find a suitable female partner in “the mission field”. There was not a lot of choice in the area I lived in, which I think is typical in a lot of areas. I’m not convinced that being Mormon lays the foundation for a lot of people to have a healthy marriage because there isn’t a lot of choice in these areas to find someone truly compatible.
Something to think about in the Mormon religion, which tends to really romanticize and spiritualize marriage more than in the general population. It might make marriage seem wonderful, but it mutes the choice for many people.
Interesting — the spokesperson for Ordain Women in the article was Hannah Wheelwright and not Kate Kelly — did Kate step down as president of Ordain Women?
Last — societies that have a gender ratio that is unfavorable to men tend to be more violent. There was the case of Pitcairn Island where mutineers from the Bounty settled with far fewer women than men. It led to murder and violence over women. Men are more aggressive than women in matters of love and it can lead to dysfunction when the men have fewer options than women…would be interesting to see if this phenomenon plays out in civilized societies that have gender ratios favorable to women…
My son told me in his BYU on campus housing ward last year there were twice as many women as men. I know this is one ward, but on campus housing wards do tend to be representative of the residency (in other words they try to make them as even as possible). FWIW, while he did date he was planning on a mission and only did so for fun. SilentDawning wrote:Interesting — the spokesperson for Ordain Women in the article was Hannah Wheelwright and not Kate Kelly — did Kate step down as president of Ordain Women?
Kate Kelly steps down from Ordain Women leadership boardLookingHard wrote:I think there is some truth in this. But instead general priesthood meeting tends to pound the same topics – the ones of “you must do better” that drives away young men.
Not to get too sidetracked but have you seen a General Women’s Session? It’s a dream. 90 minutes. I don’t really need to say much more than that but I will.
The phenomenon isn’t limited to the LDS church.
Why Are Women More Religious Than Men?What SD said. There are serious issues with how we talk about gender in the Church, but this seemed like taking a conclusion and building a case no matter what.
SilentDawning wrote:Where the article lost me was the BYU numbers. How they say the ratio is more men than women at BYU, but then they focus on the freshman class, which has a 62:38 ratio for men to women.Older men will date younger women, but the reverse is less likely. So, I’m not sure the crisis is as bad at BYU as they say. I felt that part was massaging the perspective on the numbers to shore up the idea there is a crisis…I don’t think there is anything unusual about there being more men than women at BYU even though there is a much higher ratio of women than men in the freshman class. One fairly simple explanation to help account for this is that many women get married at BYU and drop out of school while their husbands continue their education. In fact, nothing in this article really surprises me or sounds that outrageous in theory. What do you expect when the Church and LDS culture basically teaches women that they should only consider marrying other “worthy” Church members that are returned missionaries while simultaneously teaching men that they are unworthy unless they stop masturbating, viewing porn/nudity, drinking, etc. permanently?
It is a perfect recipe for the end result we see of, “a good man is hard to find” for many LDS women when the Church has defined what it means to be good in such a strict and unrealistic way. The fact is that the natural numbers are fairly close to 50/50 but the Church is basically weeding out a higher percentage of men than women and it sounds like men are more likely to leave organized religion and be atheists in general than women are in a way that doesn’t only apply to Mormonism. The interesting thing about this article to me is that it sounds like the discrepancy has gotten significantly worse recently from 52% female in 1990 to 60% female in 2008.
russdm wrote:I am sure I will be ready to marry an LDS girl/woman once I get rid of all baggage or problems that could cause any pain, so she won’t have to put up with it. One can’t bring one’s failures and past mistakes into the relationship, now can we? Better that I remain single until the problem is fixed than hurt someone, seeing how you only get one chance at Eternal Marriage.
Constantly hearing a message about how one is not worthy, based on one’s life actions/past history and despite any attempted changes, to marry any of these LDS Girls/Women does not encourage one to date these women since you don’t fit the needed Peter Priesthood paradigm. Why go after people who you know want you and whom you would only hurt for being you? What is the point? It feels better to date those outside the church, since one is closer in terms of equal value there.
HERE HERE!!!!!!
It is WAY easier to date outside of the church. In my situation, I do honestly some day want to have the option of the temple again. But, I have baggage. Oops.
I have not met a woman in my age range who didn’t have baggage as well. Go figure.
I don’t know why, but this phrase made me laugh out loud in a good way due to its naked (no pun intended) accuracy: DevilsAdvocate wrote:What do you expect when the Church and LDS culture basically teaches women that they should only consider marrying other “worthy” Church members that are returned missionaries while simultaneously teaching men that they are unworthy unless they stop masturbating, viewing porn/nudity, drinking, etc. permanently?
Prepare to throw fruit, but the thought continually occurs to me that the reason women are staying in more than men is that hardly anything is required of women, yet women are “entitled” to be cared for by a man who has to be worthy of her despite the fact that the only thing the woman is required to do is just show up and have a uterus. Hawkgrrl wrote – Quote:Prepare to throw fruit, but the thought continually occurs to me that the reason women are staying in more than men is that hardly anything is required of women, yet women are “entitled” to be cared for by a man who has to be worthy of her despite the fact that the only thing the woman is required to do is just show up and have a uterus.
No fruit throwing here. Only applause
:clap:
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