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Enoch, That was a great explanation, thank you!!!
f4h1
Orson wrote:I don’t think that is a serious criticism of the BoM either, it simply illuminates part of the process of its revelation.
I agree with you Orson. It is helpful to understand the relationship of scripture and history to better illuminate the nature of revelation.
I finished downloaded the rest of the podcast this weekend–it was much faster. I’ve only listened to part 1 so far–I am loving this!!! I’ve heard references to many of these things, but without the background, I never understood the issues very well. This is a wonderful resource! I don’t know if the interview addresses gnosticism yet–so far I haven’t heard any references. Currently I’m at the part where Paul is writing letters to Galatians, Corinthians, etc. I understand there is diversity, but does this diversity include Gnosticism? (I’ve had a debate with someone else that claims Gnosticism comes much later, but I thought that there were Jewish Gnostics prior to Christ’s birth, and some of these may have embraced Christ’s message.)
Yes MH, you’ll find they do touch on it. I finished listening to the series this weekend. I have to say I am beyond impressed, I wish it was three times as long. From a StayLDS perspective I think the last segment is one that will prove to be important for generations to come.
Orson wrote:I finished listening to the series this weekend. I have to say I am beyond impressed, I wish it was three times as long.
Two quick notes:
1. There was a 25 minute section missing from Part 3 at the 14:54 minute mark. It covers the Gospel of Luke. I found the missing clip from my editing “floor” and spliced it back in. The new “Part 3” file on Mormon Stories has the correction.
2. We actually started this project expecting to turn it into a running series over the course of several months. So we already have a “three times as long” project started with about 12 hours recorded. It’s the same topic material, but I wasn’t pushing Jared so hard to compact and condense it — tons more depth and information. We are planning on continuing that series, and probably adding more like it at a new site I am working on with Jared called “Searching Mormonism.” There’s a shell for it setup here:
http://www.searchingmormonism.org Cool! Thanks Brian! I am thinking for Searching Mormonism a lecture format, even video with images and other media inserted strategically will be better than continuing the interview/conversation format. We will have to play with it. Brian, would you maybe want to post the 12 hours already recorded on here in the meantime?
I downloaded Part 3 this morning about 8:30 MT. Did I get the missing 25 minutes? I love the idea of Searching Mormonism. I’m sure I’ll be a regular reader/listener.
Yeah; Brian and John Dehlin fixed it last night. The updated Part 3 is 1:36 in length. The old one was around 1:11 long. It looks like I got the short version. I’ll have to see if I can download the longer version. I am glad I downloaded the longer version of part 3–it made much more sense. I also have to say that I may have to transcribe portions of these podcasts, especially on the Revelation of St John. That book is just too weird to me, and it was nice to have a new perspective on it. I’m just beginning part 4 now (the historical Jesus).
There have been some glancing references to Gnosticism, and it is interesting to me that Anderson compares Mormon Intellectuals to Gnostics of the day. I guess I can see a bit of resemblance there, but it seems to me that Gnosticism had so much strange mythology (a new creation story, making Cain and Judas the “good guys”, resurrection of body=bad, a good god and a bad god–with the bad god being called Jehovah or Elohim–I forget which one) that I have a hard time calling them just a bunch of intellectual Christians. I don’t know–maybe Anderson discusses this further in part 4 of 5. But from what I know of Gnosticism (which is what I read in Ehrmann’s book on the Gospel of Judas), Gnosticism is much more than simply intellectualism.
Anyone know if Anderson will do the same thing for the Old Testament? Could anything like this be done for the Book of Mormon? (I am loving this stuff–makes me want to get a Master of Divinity or something.)
Ah, what the hell… I will out myself to this wonderful little community. 
I was not trying to make too much of the parallel between Gnostics and Mormons, though we do have strikingly similar questions “where are we from, why are we here, where are we going” as different as the answers may be. I was using one particular parallel… that heresy hunters such as Irenaeus and Tertullian complained that you could not tell a Gnostic when you see one, because they read the same scriptures and went to the same meetings, but attributed very different meaning. You are correct that it breaks down after that point. That and I was playing with the Agnostic/Gnostic parallel, as I did in my “Love and Lying” paper.
I have considered talking to John about doing an Old Testament companion podcast for Mormon Stories, and perhaps lay out my approach to religion more clearly, answer questions, etc. We will see.
No matter what Brian and I will be moving forward with Searching Mormonism. I plan on putting together a 20+ hour lecture on the New Testament, History of the Bible etc. We want to do similar mini-courses on all the Standard Works. What I was thinking for the Book of Mormon was getting something like “Five Approaches to the Book of Mormon”, from taking it pretty literally to understanding it as inspired fiction. But we will for sure have one on the OT over there, whether or not there is a short OT Mormon Stories podcast.
Glad you are enjoying it!
Awesome, Enoch! I have to say I am not a podster, and so I have to sit at my computer to listen. So the podcast was very long. And yet I sat through the entire thing (over the course of about a week since this thread was started). Thanks for doing it. Much of it was refresher, but it was good refresher. I think I have been exposed by PBS “From Jesus to Christ” and so forth.
Tom
Enoch, I’m glad to know you don’t care about your anonymity. Some of us aren’t so brave! I’ve always been a bit fascinated with Gnosticism, Nag Hammadi, Dead Sea Scrolls, and the Documentary Hypothesis (in case you’re ever looking for other topics!)
I’m on to part 5 now. I’ve heard that some people think the Gospel of Thomas might be the Source Q. Do you have any opinions on that?
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