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Hello, everyone. Like many before me, I have been lurking for months but this is my first post. Glad to be here. Backstory — I converted in college, now in my 40s. I served a mission, married in the temple. I have a great wife and great kids. I am a former “everything” — bishop, bishopric counselor, EQP, HPGL, etc. I’ve served and “contributed” at church nearly non-stop since my baptism until recently. (I still attend church and I have a calling, but it is a non-time-consuming, non-ministerial calling, by my request).
I have had “a shelf” for as long as I can remember but it was a comfortable one. I investigated the church on my own using both church-produced and “anti” materials before I even met the missionaries so I have always been aware of the more “controversial” aspects of church history and doctrine. After months of reading on my own, I eventually had the discussions with the missionaries. (This was in college). My baptism followed just a short time later. I continued to study all aspects of the church from both approved and “un-approved” sources — in an effort to “catch up,” I suppose. On my mission, when investigators (or bashers) brought up something controversial, I always knew what they were referring to and always had an answer for them, as I recall. Seems to me I knew MUCH more about the church, it’s history and doctrine as a 1-year convert than any of my BIC companions did. (I really hope that doesn’t sound like bragging — it’s definitely not. I’m just trying to paint the picture that I was well-versed in Mormonism from the start due to the uniqueness of my conversion and early membership. I don’t think I’ve come across anything really “new” in 15 years or so.) So, why the faith crisis now? I’m not sure the answer to that. Mid-life crisis? Perhaps. Regrets of opportunities lost because of church involvement? Not sure really. But there is definitely a “faith crisis” going on, wrapped up in something of a “life crisis” at the same time. No one in the real world knows about this except my wife (she is TBM and very loving and supportive of the situation) and I think most who know me would be surprised. I am not ready to let the cat out of the bag with her TBM family or our TBM friends yet as I am not sure where I am going to land.
For many years I claimed to “know” the church was true, blah, blah, blah and I believed what I said. Now, my faith is much different. I’m still trying to figure it out.
I have loved (in the past) the things that Mormonism has brought to my life and I hate to think where my life would have ended up if I had not joined the church. (Choices I made in high school and college were definitely leading me to a disasterous outcome). So, in no way do I regret joining the church or the life I have made as a result — great wife, kids, etc. But I just don’t know what “true” means anymore and I’m trying to figure that out. Consequently, I question alot of things about the church, the culture of the church, and to a some extent “the gospel” as it is currently understood and taught by the correlation committee. (I also really appreciate some things I’m hearing lately from some of the apostles — Holland, Uchtdorf, etc.) I do not find much value, however, in real world association with the saints anymore; there was a time I survived on it. Sac Mtg, SS, priesthood lessons and callings are all chores to endure, not experiences to enjoy. (No offense to my really good SS teacher).
For the first time, I suppose I am excercising what feels like faith — I pray because I hope someone is listening (not because I KNOW He — or She?? — is); I pay tithing because I hope the money is being used to support an organization that is doing good (not because I KNOW it is a commandment from God); I go to the temple because I hope the occasional feelings I have there of my “greater purpose” are from God (and not just because it is pretty and quiet — and I like pretty and quiet places); I take the sacrament because I need “second chances” and hope that the ordinance provides that.
Well, I’ve rambled. Thanks for reading. I have wanted to “join in” for a long time. Not sure how active I’ll be here but I appreciate what I’ve learned here so far from so many of you. I guess the bottom line is I’ve decided to stay LDS, but to do it on my terms. I’m just not sure what “my terms” are yet.
Welcome. Good luck with your journey. I feel like I always say this to new people here, probably because I do, but we have much in common. I’m glad you took the time to introduce yourself and it sounds like you have much to offer so I hope you can see your way to playing a more active part here. I’d like to hear some more of your perspectives. Welcome, and thanks for sharing your experiences with us. I like what you say about feeling like you are exercising faith for the first time. I’ve always felt that faith was believing something and taking action despite a lack of evidence, whereas most Mormons seem to take belief and treat it as rock-solid knowledge. I think actual faith is more self aware and takes more commitment. Welcome to StayLDS. Just like DarkJedi I can say that we have a lot in common. I joined the church in college and would later serve a mission. One key difference was that I didn’t explore anti material because at that stage in my life anti material was just pamphlets filled with vicious lies.
LDSThomas wrote:I do not find much value, however, in real world association with the saints anymore; there was a time I survived on it. Sac Mtg, SS, priesthood lessons and callings are all chores to endure, not experiences to enjoy. (No offense to my really good SS teacher).
I feel the same. I won’t go so far as to say I’ve outgrown the lessons taught in church, to me taking that position would insinuate I’m somehow “better” than others… and I know for a fact that there are people in church that are far more loving and charitable than I am. I’ve got a long, long way to go to get where I want to be. I will say that I
havechanged and the type of lessons taught in church no longer nourish me spiritually. I think the TBM in me would tell me that I no longer hold the role of being nourished, rather mine is the responsibility to nourish and in so doing I will find the nourishment I seek. Still, the lessons can be a chore. I’ve mentioned before, I’m no prick kicker. I’m grateful for decisions made despite my reservations about the church. Heck, I’m still making decisions that keep me sticking around. Decisions these days are a bit more difficult and are taken a bit more slowly though. I too am still trying to figure it out.
Welcome Thomas! My first thought is you have striking similarities to Bill Reel, but it sounds like different personality traits and needs. I hope you enjoy your time among us, and I look forward to hearing more.
This is IMO the toughest one to deal with. I did a post about “geographically” mapping out one’s issues, and I believe that issues in this geography are the most difficult to overcome. What do you do when you feel like you aren’t getting anything out of your association with fellow saints, or worse, when you just feel like they holding you back in some way or even not being very good people? To me, the ward level is where Mormonism lives, not in its history, not in the Q12, and if your issues are in your own family or yourself, the ward can actually give you a respite. When wards fail, that’s the real problem. I struggle with this one too. hawkgrrrl wrote:This is IMO the toughest one to deal with. I did a post about “geographically” mapping out one’s issues, and I believe that issues in this geography are the most difficult to overcome. What do you do when you feel like you aren’t getting anything out of your association with fellow saints, or worse, when you just feel like they holding you back in some way or even not being very good people? To me, the ward level is where Mormonism lives, not in its history, not in the Q12, and if your issues are in your own family or yourself, the ward can actually give you a respite. When wards fail, that’s the real problem. I struggle with this one too.
Hawkgrrrl, would you link that post. I think I remember reading it but I’m feeling the need to revisit it…Thanks,
Cate
PS I should add that my experience validates what you wrote above. It’s the goodness of my ward which gives me hope that my struggles with culture, institutional policies and practices, and history will eventually be addressed in some way. If I were in an absolutely awful ward with no support, I know I would struggle more. Years ago, we were stationed in Georgia and the ward was hell. I always felt unwelcome, like I was slinking in through the back door. Much of the time my husband was deployed so it was just me and 3 very young children (3,1,newborn). I got much more love from the wives in our battalion than I did the Relief Society. And the bishopric was a man dying of cancer who could not attend and two young counselors who spent most of their time in snide conversation about various ward members.
I remember confessing to my mom that I hated attending. She chastised me as only a loving mother can. Then a family moved into my home stake and my mom as the stake RS pres. had to conduct orientation for the new sister (a new ward rs pres). As they got introduced, mom asked this new sister where all they had lived in their army career. She mentioned the ward I was in and then volunteered, “It’s good we moved. I almost went inactive. It’s the worst ward we’ve ever attended and the members are just nasty.”
My mom called me from the car leaving that meeting to apologize. LOL.
Oh – and this was all when I was blissfully unaware of most of the issues I now know so well… back when my shelf had a mere few pamphlets resting on it.
LDSThomas wrote:For many years I claimed to “know” the church was true, blah, blah, blah and I believed what I said. Now, my faith is much different. I’m still trying to figure it out.
I have loved (in the past) the things that Mormonism has brought to my life and I hate to think where my life would have ended up if I had not joined the church. (Choices I made in high school and college were definitely leading me to a disasterous outcome). So, in no way do I regret joining the church or the life I have made as a result — great wife, kids, etc. But I just don’t know what “true” means anymoreand I’m trying to figure that out. Consequently, I question alot of things about the church, the culture of the church, and to a some extent “the gospel” as it is currently understood and taught by the correlation committee. (I also really appreciate some things I’m hearing lately from some of the apostles — Holland, Uchtdorf, etc.) I do not find much value, however, in real world association with the saints anymore; there was a time I survived on it. Sac Mtg, SS, priesthood lessons and callings are all chores to endure, not experiences to enjoy. (No offense to my really good SS teacher). Hi, LDSThomas – Glad you’re here. I also know that the church has blessed my life, and I wonder sometimes if I’m just supposed to “dance with the one that brung me.” But then I think that God’s not a possessive boyfriend for the night. He wants what makes me my best self.
There was a time I survived on church activity, too, but I think of it now as my former house upon the sand. I’m not going back there. If I’m going to stay in the church – happily – I have to be more authentic. So, baby steps in that direction in 2014.
THANKS to each of you for the welcome. I really appreciate it. I do feel that I am among fellow travelers. Thoreau, DarkJedi, mercyngrace and Ann: Thanks for your welcome and comments and my best to all of you.
Daeruin — I agree with your thoughts on faith. The “fake it till you make it” approach of many church members (IMO) often prevents us from being real with each other — so I never really feel like I know who is where on their faith journey in the real world. And, consequently, I don’t feel comfortable revealing where I really am either. I don’t ever remember hearing someone say in a testimony meeting “I HOPE the church is true” or “I have FAITH that the church is true.” (I have grown to have a love/hate relationship with the word “true” — but that’s another matter). Consequently, I find it hard to bond/relate with ward members on a personal level. Perhaps if I were more honest with where I am, others would be, too. But I am not really interested in being labeled a “project” by the HPGL or the stake, haha. My bishop is a little bit aware that “life is hard” right now because of some other issues (but I haven’t discussed any “faith crisis” stuff in real detail). He is a great guy but I’m not sure if I would ever discuss this with him.
Nibbler — I re-read your intro. I should/could have just copied and pasted yours into mine — sounds very similar.
Orson — Thanks for the comparison to Bill Reel — but not sure I’m deserving of it. (Although I am pretty accepting of others — wherever they are on their journey, as I think he is). I am impressed with what I know about him/have learned from him.
Hawkgrrrl — “the ward level is where Mormonism lives” — I like that. Or, in an uninspiring setting, I suppose it is where Mormonism dies, sadly, for some of us. (My ward is filled with good people — I just don’t feel I have much in common with them — especially the high priests that I hang out with 3rd hour!)
Again, thanks for the welcome. Just putting my thoughts out there has lifted a weight off my shoulders and I look forward to wherever the road leads.
LDSThomas wrote:Daeruin — I agree with your thoughts on faith. The “fake it till you make it” approach of many church members (IMO) often prevents us from being real with each other — so I never really feel like I know who is where on their faith journey in the real world. And, consequently, I don’t feel comfortable revealing where I really am either. I don’t ever remember hearing someone say in a testimony meeting “I HOPE the church is true” or “I have FAITH that the church is true.” (I have grown to have a love/hate relationship with the word “true” — but that’s another matter). Consequently, I find it hard to bond/relate with ward members on a personal level. Perhaps if I were more honest with where I am, others would be, too. But I am not really interested in being labeled a “project” by the HPGL or the stake, haha. My bishop is a little bit aware that “life is hard” right now because of some other issues (but I haven’t discussed any “faith crisis” stuff in real detail). He is a great guy but I’m not sure if I would ever discuss this with him.
I know of one person who has stood up in sacrament meeting and said “I hope the church is true.” I wish I had been there. She blogs at agnosticmormonmom.blogspot.com. She has a lot of good stuff on her blog. I definitely recommend it.Daeruin wrote:I know of one person who has stood up in sacrament meeting and said “I hope the church is true.” I wish I had been there. She blogs at agnosticmormonmom.blogspot.com. She has a lot of good stuff on her blog. I definitely recommend it.
Thanks, I visited her blog and will spend more time there when I have a chance.
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