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Amen, friend. Amazing! I just read through my talk and found that it was one of the drafts, so I made a few corrections. There might be other errors so please excuse the mistakes. I did find out that there were some complaints about this talk from a few people. In a meeting with the stake leaders for the YM and YW, and a former Bishop made a statement something like,” Well I have heard everything, our High Councilor said today that women can wear pants to church” and there was a discussion about that subject for a few minutes with many angry remarks until one person spoke up and said that I said something about a news release, so the Stake YW president looked it up on her lap top and then said “yep, that’s is what the news release says.” Just a side note, the person who told me the story confirmed something that I have been noticing lately. I told him that I felt like people were getting nervous and seemed to to distancing themselves from me and he said that he has heard some talk and that I was right. He is of the opinion that I am about 3-5 ahead of the curve on all of this and that I need to cool it some. I have had very mixed emotion about all of this. Every month after my talks I feel pretty good and get a lot of thank you’s but then later on I hear about how I upset others. Again, as I have mentioned before, I feel like my SP is supporting me, but to see others who I felt were friends to some degree, at least as far as church is concerned, give me the cold shoulder, it kind of bothers me and hurts. I can take that to some extent but it does take some of the joy out of going to church, and to tell you the truth, at times there is little joy left. One of the things that keeps me going is that I can look myself in the mirror and still feel like I am being true to my own believes. Hopefully that, and the support I feel from some at church and my friends here at StayLDS will be enough to get me by until the changes that I hope are happening at church, do happen. The people who are complaining need to be challenged, and your Stake President is supporting you. Don’t go out of your way to cause issues, but don’t back away from sharing our perspective and using “official material” as you do so. Seriously, for example, if someone doesn’t understand that the Church itself has said that it’s okay for women to wear pants to church, they need to know it.
It’s controversy like the “Women and pants” issue that holds the Church back. Micromanaging the congregation is not a good thing. If a Sister wants to wear pants, there should be no controversy regarding it. Church, You talk was incredible. It is needed. I think I would have been shocked to hear it before my FC and it would have bugged me enough to find the truth. “And the truth shall set you free” comes to mind. You are what the church needs. Even if you ruffle a few feathers, you are needed. As long as your SP is behind you, and you have the opportunity to serve in this manner, I hope you will have the courage to continue delivering the truth. Not to ruffle feathers on purpose, but with a pure heart of delivering TRUTH.
I had NO idea about the church coming out with an official statement. I was a woman who found it appalling that other women wanted to wear pants to church and am now ashamed that I stood against it publicly on FB. (which is why I vow not to make any stance on FB on any personal beliefs such as religion or politics EVER AGAIN!) I want to make that right some kind of way, although it was what I felt to be right at the time.
Anyway, I hope to be as brave as you. I pray for more church leaders such as yourself. We have no idea of those that are suffering b/c we don’t know the truth and desperately crave it. I think of all that suffer b/c of the black and white thinking. I am sure you have no idea the impact you are making in the lives of others. I am sorry that you are getting the cold shoulder. I suppose people such as you and cwald and others who are wanting to do what is right in their hearts are “taking one for the team” and paving the way for the rest of us. Thank you!
opentofreedom wrote:Church,
You talk was incredible. It is needed. I think I would have been shocked to hear it before my FC and it would have bugged me enough to find the truth. “And the truth shall set you free” comes to mind. You are what the church needs. Even if you ruffle a few feathers, you are needed. As long as your SP is behind you, and you have the opportunity to serve in this manner, I hope you will have the courage to continue delivering the truth. Not to ruffle feathers on purpose, but with a pure heart of delivering TRUTH.
I had NO idea about the church coming out with an official statement. I was a woman who found it appalling that other women wanted to wear pants to church and am now ashamed that I stood against it publicly on FB. (which is why I vow not to make any stance on FB on any personal beliefs such as religion or politics EVER AGAIN!) I want to make that right some kind of way, although it was what I felt to be right at the time.
Anyway, I hope to be as brave as you. I pray for more church leaders such as yourself. We have no idea of those that are suffering b/c we don’t know the truth and desperately crave it. I think of all that suffer b/c of the black and white thinking. I am sure you have no idea the impact you are making in the lives of others. I am sorry that you are getting the cold shoulder. I suppose people such as you and cwald and others who are wanting to do what is right in their hearts are “taking one for the team” and paving the way for the rest of us. Thank you!
Thank you. It is very nice to hear that. I just wish the church was better about getting the word out. I think they keep many things very low key so that as in this example the news release plaques the few without upsetting the others. There is way too much of this for my liking.Church, First I think it is ironic that of all the stuff you presented in your talk the sticking point was the pants issue (something that the church was very clear on in an official statement).
This brings me to my next point. If I weren’t frequenting StayLDS or BCC I might never know of these new developments (JS papers, caffeine ok, pants ok, less acrimony with homosexuality, Mitch Mayne). This comes to the point of “active dissemination.” Where does a church member go to understand church doctrine/policy?
church0333 wrote:I told him that I felt like people were getting nervous and seemed to to distancing themselves from me and he said that he has heard some talk and that I was right. He is of the opinion that I am about 3-5 ahead of the curve on all of this and that I need to cool it some. I have had very mixed emotion about all of this. Every month after my talks I feel pretty good and get a lot of thank you’s but then later on I hear about how I upset others. Again, as I have mentioned before, I feel like my SP is supporting me, but to see others who I felt were friends to some degree, at least as far as church is concerned, give me the cold shoulder, it kind of bothers me and hurts. I can take that to some extent but it does take some of the joy out of going to church, and to tell you the truth, at times there is little joy left.
This is the next and more serious component. At one time I felt that you hadn’t yet learned to keep your head down. Later I developed a considerable amount of respect for you as someone who is directing change within your sphere of influence for the better. But regardless of what paradigm we look at – fool or pioneer – there are social costs to what you are doing. I don’t believe that I could have given that talk in my SM without people totally writing me off. You have the advantage of being in the high council with a supportive SP and so you have some credibility. Eventually you will be released and you may find that all the intangible connections or social glue of “you are one of us” have eroded and all that is left is the cold shoulder.
opentofreedom wrote:I suppose people such as you and cwald and others who are wanting to do what is right in their hearts are “taking one for the team” and paving the way for the rest of us.
What sucks is that this “taking one for the team” is inflicted from within our own team…kinda gives new meaning to the following scripture: Zachariah 13:6
Quote:If someone asks, ‘What are these wounds on your body?’ they will answer, ‘The wounds I was given at the house of my friends.’
church0333 wrote:I just read through my talk and found that it was one of the drafts, so I made a few corrections. There might be other errors so please excuse the mistakes.
Hey, no worries. The idea of inspired writing having “the errors of men” is a canonised principle in our scriptures. It’s just that most Mormons forget about it sometimes.
I remember for a while having people give me a bit of a wide birth after I started being a bit more vocal about my perspectives last year. I was still ‘angry’ then so it probably came out.
The church needs people like you. We need our presumptions to be challenged – in a respectful way.
Thanks church…it’s people like you that make me believe in the mission of stayLDS. Good luck.
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