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So true. We all learn hopefully. Bridget Well, its been two weeks now and not a peep from anyone at the lds church. In the meantime, I did attend the Port Orange Christian Church last Sunday and it was great. I sat next to the youth pastors mom and told her how wonderful her son was for getting us 8 guys to unload our Uhaul. That made her feel good. Then last Tuesday, I went to their ‘girlfriends’ book club and was able to share about my book. Three women were very interested as they have loved ones dealing with the gay issue. So, it will be interesting how God will use me here. This morning I did decide to go to the lds church here. The meetings were good and I met some nice people. I ran into the bishop and he was polite, but we were both very uncomfortable around each other. He has never called or asked to talk to me since I sent him that letter and did not mention it today. That was two weeks ago. Some men asked about my husband and what priesthood he held. I said he was a high priest but not active. It seemed to disappoint them. Nothing about how sorry they are that he is not active and lets see what we can do to activate him. I think I will have my husband call this Bishop this week and talk to him, as he needs to know that he really offended us. It is important to talk things out with people, otherwise uncomfortable feelings continue. It is difficult for me because culturally I am Mormon, but I struggle with my faith. Sometimes, I do not feel like I fit in anywhere.
Quote:Some men asked about my husband and what priesthood he held. I said he was a high priest but not active. It seemed to disappoint them. Nothing about how sorry they are that he is not active and lets see what we can do to activate him.
Bridget, just to consider:
1) Should it not have disappointed them? Would it have made you feel better if they had rejoiced at his being inactive?
2) Would you or your husband have been open to relative strangers asking about how to activate him? Maybe these people have tried asking others that question and been accused of being obnoxious – and been told, “Leave us alone. Why can’t you let go and give us space?” Maybe they thought they were doing the right thing by not “getting all up in your business”.
Have you stopped and considered what your Bishop might be thinking? I am NOT trying to excuse him by what I’m about to write, and I realize completely that I’m suggesting the other extreme from what you’re describing, but I think you need to step back and try to let go of the offense you are feeling. Maybe realizing that the following scenario is plausible – and that there are innumerable other plausible scenarios between yours and the one below – can help you start to realize that, perhaps, you have judged this Bishop every bit as much as, perhaps, he has judged you. (Even if your version is 100% correct, it still helps to consider the alternative.)
Try looking at it from this angle – taken fictionally from a Bishop’s journal:
Quote:Day 1: Got a phone call from another sister who is moving into our ward soon. Her husband is inactive, and she asked if we could help move them into the ward. I wish I could have told her we would be there, but the members here have been burned so many times by similar requests that I know they won’t volunteer again. I tried to find out if they were going to be actively involved in the ward before I made any promises, but I must have offended her. Sometimes this calling sucks.
Day 2: Got a letter from the sister who called earlier. It was a good letter, but it’s obvious I offended her. How do I reach her and her husband? I try one thing with someone, and they get mad at me – so I try something else with the next person, and they get mad at me – so I try something else with the next person, and they get mad at me. Sometimes this calling sucks.
Day 3: I was right. It’s been two weeks since they moved into the ward, and they haven’t been here. In fact, I heard today that they are attending a different church in town. I want to help them, but if they are attending a different church they probably will be even more offended if I contact them and look like I’m trying to guilt them into coming here. Sometimes this calling sucks.
Day 4: She attended church today, and I just didn’t know what to say. She obviously is upset at me; I’m sure I offended her; what can I do? Some of the members asked about her husband, and when they learned he is inactive, I could see how deflated they were. They’ve been praying that someone would move into the ward who can share the load they are carrying; now they are trying to keep smiling while realizing there’s one more member someone has to try to reach – when they can’t reach the other members who are inactive and already living in the ward. Sometimes this calling sucks.
I have no idea what the complete picture would show, but I am fairly certain it would be somewhere between what you perceive and what I just proposed. I know that’s almost always the case in my own life in similar situations.
Thank you Ray, This is why this forum is so helpful. Sometimes, we are to close to a situation to see any other perspective but ours. Your examples have been helpful to me. Bridget Update. My husband called this bishop last night on the phone ( he is still in Iowa trying to sell our home). He told the bishop that he had tried to talk to him before he went back to Iowa, but it did not work out because he was out of town that Sunday. He told the bishop that he did not think it was appropriate to interrogate me on the phone like he did and that he felt his help was going to be conditional based on whether we had strong testimones. My husband said that no one from the church had come to check on me (visiting teachers or home teachers) since being here by myself for the past 2 and a half weeks and that I felt like they really did not care to have us in their ward because we had problems with our testimony. He explained to the bishop why he had left the church (because he never got the witness from Moroni’s promise about the Book of Mormon). The bishop told him that God would never do that and that living the gospel was easy and simple. That something must be wrong with my husband if he did not get a witness. My husband told him that if he died and met Christ tommorrow that he would have a good conscience because he knows he was honest and sincere in trying to get a testimony for over 30 years. The bishop asked my husband if we were going to visit other churches (non lds) and my husband said yes. Bishop ________ then said that he was warning him where that could lead and that he would be excommunicated if he joined another church. My husband told him that the saying “I don’t care how much you know until I know how much you care,’ comes into play here. He told the bishop that he came across as a ‘letter of the law’ type of jew and ‘not the spirit’ which offened him. He said to the bishop that he never showed any empathy to his wife when she shared she was the only member and about her struggles with the church. He never asked why she felt that way or lets talk about what’s troubling you; Only, how her lack of testimony could pollute the ward members. So, it did not go well, and basically we don’t want to talk to this bishop again. I did go to Relief Society today and someone mentioned that the bishop bore his testimony about how anyone that doesn’t get an answer that the church is not true is because they are talking themselves out of it. So, I do not know what to do now.
bridget_night wrote:So, I do not know what to do now.
Hi Bridget. Your bishop is what we used to call an “iron rod.” As Liahonas, we don’t relate to their way of thinking, and it is futile to try. They will never understand us. They are doing what they think is right. That doesn’t mean it is…just let them think it is.
I’ve found the best approach with them is to thank them for their efforts…thank them for their service. They aren’t your judge…even though they want to be. Just smile and let them do their thing….
Honestly, my advice is to let it drop. At this point, it’s just an argument between two stubborn men – and it won’t get any better if either of them tries to fix it. Seriously, your husband called the Bishop an insensitive ass, and the Bishop told him he’s spiritually lazy. It’s now a macho pissing contest between two men who believe firmly they are right.
From my perspective, neither one is. I’d be willing to bet that, when viewed from the big picture viewpoint, BOTH of them are wrong – but I’d also be willing to bet that neither of them believe that and neither of them is willing to reconsider and change their minds. They are too mad and stubborn to do so – BOTH of them. So, let it drop. Nothing good is going to come of it if it stays active – nothing at all.
Let it drop. It is what it is, and you have to accept that and forgive the Bishop for his role in it – and your husband for his – and yourself for yours. There’s plenty of blame that can be thrown about. Walk away from that game and just let it drop.
Didn’t I say that???? 
😆 You are absolutely right Rix and Ray. It’s over for me and now I have better things to do. I am meeting with a group tomorrow called “Wounded Heart” for abused people and doing a ministry of helping them as a hairdresser and make over artist. I have done this in the past for battered women. I also connected with a group from the community of Christ called the “Jesus Clinic.” A medical couple sold their big house and opened a free clinic for people who have jobs but no health insurance. Other health care professionals give their time and serivice to this. My youngest son is in this category and could really use this kind of health care. Unless you are real poor or have a good job with health care you have a rough time. So, I am meeting really good people in the community and churches who really show the love of Christ. I prayed to be guided this morning and to let God know that only his opinion of me matters and it gave me strength to not need others approval to feel good.
Thanks for all your help guys.
Bridget
Quote:Didn’t I say that????
In the mouths of two or three witnesses . . .
😈 😆 bridget_night wrote:I did go to Relief Society today and someone mentioned that the bishop bore his testimony about how anyone that doesn’t get an answer that the church is not true is because they are talking themselves out of it. So, I do not know what to do now.
I guess the RS testimony from the bishop is second hand…so it is kind of hard to really know what he was saying and what he meant…but assuming it meant exactly what you typed there, that is a very TBM view of the world. I think it is very common for people with that view to just not really understand why anyone would not get an answer or not immediately recognize or accept an answer. That doesn’t mean they are right, it just means they can’t empathize because they don’t understand that point of view. That is why it can be difficult explaining it to others…they don’t get it unless they’ve experienced something like it, and as Rix says, there seems to be differing personalities (“Iron Rodders” and “Liahonas”), one is not better than the other, one is not more correct than the other, one is not more righteous than the other. Just different personalities.Heber13 wrote:…that is a very TBM view of the world. …they don’t get it
Yep, if I had a dime for every time I’ve said that exact quote…
Brian Johnston wrote:I can also tell you that sometimes LDS Wards get burned by “strangers” who are members, but not ever active. The only call is out of the blue when they want to save $1,000 hiring professional movers. I didn’t go to this one move, but heard horror stories about it. A lady called up who had lived in the area for years. They didn’t even know she was a member (not on rosters). The Elders Quorum decided to be “nice” and reach out to her, having several people show up. The lady hadn’t packed or anything. It took them over
10 hoursto get her stuff in the truck! And the whole time she was being all obsessive and loudly complaining they weren’t doing anything right. Never a single thanks. You never know when there’s been a recent bad experience that might have soured the attitude, which isn’t your fault at all.
That’s an extreme example, I must admit, but I suspect, there must be two sides to every story, and she might have had a different opinion.
I mean how old was she, how rich, and was she living on her own? She may have been paranoid about stuff breaking as well.
Well, a little more update for you all. The Relief Society President, a single sister in her fifties (married once at 50 for just a year), and a convert to the church, went to dinner with me last night and a movie. We had a really nice time and good talk. I tend to enjoy and get along better with people who were not always in the church better than ‘lifers.’ Or at least with people who have had to struggle at one time or another with their testimony. Anyway, I was able to share with her what happened when I moved into the ward and she said that a number of people have had problems with this bishop including herself. She said he went to law school, and tends to have a very cold, straight laced personality. She told me that she was glad he was not the bishop when she moved here from New Jersey or she might have never moved into the ward and probably left the church. Anyway, it helped talking to her and to reaffirm that some leaders just have problems (like all of us, but in different ways.) Today, when I attended SS and RS, things seemed to be better as far as me feeling more comfortable in the ward. I was also able to have lunch with a German single sister in the ward this past week and felt like I had a few friends in the ward now. Interestingly, the bishops wife came up to me after RS and gave me a hug and thanked me for helping her last week. I said, “What for?” She said, “You showed concern for me when I was having a rough day.” Her daughter had left the garage freezer open the night before and all the ice cream melted and meat spoiled over night. The ice cream ran all over the garage floor and there was such a mess to clean up. The money lost from spoiled food was not cheap either. This happened the morning of Mothers day. Anyway, I saw she was near tears and patted her on the back and was very empathetic. I told her that I can see she was ready to burst out in tears and I felt so bad for her. Interesting, how showing some geniune concern for someone can mean a whole lot. She teaches the gospel doctrine class and does a good job. She weighs about 400 pounds and all of her kids are very overweight, so I think she is very sensitive about that. Anyway, I like the bishops wife. She wanted to make sure I came out to the Ward Hawwiaan Luau this coming Sat. As far as the bishop goes, he just walks right by me and never even says hello. It’s ok if we don’t ever get along even though I wish it were not that way. I have come to learn to not personalize everything so much anymore and just enjoy what I can in whatever ward I am in. Quote:I have come to learn to not personalize everything so much anymore and just enjoy what I can in whatever ward I am in.
Thank you for sharing the update – and especially for the sentence above. “I enjoy what I can” is such a great perspective.
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