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OK, Ray introduced me to the term “orthoprax”. I looked it up, and means concerned with conduct rather than religions belief (correct me if my paraphrase is wrong Ray or anyone with knowledge). For me it’s a lot like the difference between behaviorism and cognitive psychology….where behaviorism is concerned with behavior without much regard for beliefs and thinking, while cognitive psychology is more concerned with thinking and beliefs than changing behavior directly. But what do I know.
I also wonder if simply focusing on doing the right thing, without any religious beliefs guiding you can produce the same kind of peace as right behavior rooted in some kind of religious belief.
For me, it’s pretty simple: I would rather do what is right while believing what is wrong than believe what is right but do what is wrong.I think actions are far more important than thoughts, if they are forced into separation – which I think can’t be done. I think beliefs influence actions almost completely – except in cases of genetic predisposition / instincts, which are stronger and more influential than most people realize.
Notice how I managed to jump all over the place in that answer and argue two conflicting ideas simultaneously? Sometimes mental gymnastics are required simply because we live in a gym.
SilentDawning wrote:I also wonder if simply focusing on doing the right thing, without any religious beliefs guiding you can produce the same kind of peace as right behavior rooted in some kind of religious belief.
yes…I think it can. It is what I’m focused on right now, and regardless of the religious setting, good behaviors and the benefits of such are what I’m after in my life right now. That can help me let go of a lot of stuff that is otherwise complex.Old-Timer wrote:I think actions are far more important than thoughts, if they are forced into separation – which I think can’t be done. I think beliefs influence actions almost completely
I also agree with this, which makes seeking correct beliefs is still the goal. It can be hard to sustain the proper actions without the underlying foundation, and over the long-haul…will be key to orthopraxy. But there are areas where until the beliefs are there to guide you, correct actions will sometimes be all I can do to get the natural consequences of those actions.
SilentDawning wrote:OK,
Ray introduced me to the term “orthoprax”. I looked it up, and means concerned with conduct rather than religions belief(correct me if my paraphrase is wrong Ray or anyone with knowledge)…For me it’s a lot like the difference between behaviorism and cognitive psychology….where behaviorism is concerned with behavior without much regard for beliefs and thinking, while cognitive psychology is more concerned with thinking and beliefs than changing behavior directly. But what do I know…I also wonder if simply focusing on doing the right thing, without any religious beliefs guiding you can produce the same kind of peace as right behavior rooted in some kind of religious belief.I always thought the term orthoprax as applied in the LDS Church would not necessarily mean practicing what you see as right actions as much as what actions are currently viewed as right by most practicing Mormons sort of like the old saying, “When in Rome, do as the Romans do.” So if you are willing to outwardly play along with the WoW, tithing, the Law of Chastity, doing callings, wearing garments and white shirts, etc. without worrying too much about any other traditional beliefs that you don’t agree with (I.E. whether the BOM, fall of Adam, etc. are true history) then it seems like it would be possible to blend in fairly easily and comfortably with other active Mormons as long as you keep most unorthodox views to yourself. However, for me this approach doesn’t really help much because the overall costs of belonging and full acceptance in the LDS culture and having so many decisions already made for me actually bother me even more than any core teachings that I already believe are either false or impossible to know to know for sure exactly how much validity there really is to them or not.
Quote:as long as you keep most unorthodox views to yourself
or learn to frame and phrase those views in orthodox terms in such a way that others realize they aren’t really unorthodox at all
There is an alternative to silence or withdrawal (even though those are legitimate and sometimes better options), but it takes more effort – and more openness to being vulnerable. It’s harder; therefore, it’s the road less traveled.
When I was 17, I was concerned that I didn’t have charity; I didn’t feel I possessed the love of Christ. I then thought about the other “charity,” which is serving others. I asked my priest quorum advisor, “If I just do the service first, without feeling charity, do you think that could lead me to feeling real charity?” The advisor was a good, older man. He got a bit teary eyed and emphatically said “Yes.” He was right. I may need to try that again. I suppose it’s a bit like the law of Moses. Or a lot like it.
I’m glad to see there’s a term defining exactly what I’m trying to do. Hope I can make it work and come to terms with this new way of life. I’m in the early stages. I’m just wondering: I don’t live in UT, have never lived in UT. Do think this is easier to do if you don’t live in UT? I’m just thinking that people where I live might be a little more relaxed and less judgmental. I may be totally wrong about this.
writer63 wrote:I don’t live in UT, have never lived in UT. Do think this is easier to do if you don’t live in UT? I’m just thinking that people where I live might be a little more relaxed and less judgmental. I may be totally wrong about this.
Yes, I do. I’ve lived in NJ, Ohio, California, Colorado and Utah. I think it is easier in other places outside UT.
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