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There are still many things I love about the church. I love the ideals of family, the common sense and compassion in the words of the general authorities, apostles and prophet. I read and study the materials for Sunday lessons each week, I get the Ensign and Friend delivered to our home. But I really dislike going to church. It’s almost a phobic feeling when I walk into a church building. I am married to a non-member and a few months ago I went to see the bishop of the ward I am currently in. I told him that I would like to attend the temple because maybe that would help me to reconnect spiritually with the church. The temple was not a good experience for me when I first attended many years ago, but I found it to be a positive and spiritual experience with time. He asked about tithing and I said I pay part-tithe because my husband is not a member and resents any money I pay to the church. The bishop then said that I would need to pay full-tithe to go to the temple, and that he’d send the home teachers around to explain to my husband how important that is. I told him that is a VERY bad idea – home teachers can’t come to our home and tell my non-member husband that we should pay tithing.
Then last week I get a call from a man I don’t know and have never met. “You are coming to our house tomorrow for temple preparation class”. I said “I am?” and he said “Yes, you are”. So I told him my husband was working on that day, and I have two young children at home so I couldn’t just drop everything and come to his house. I’m assuming the bishop must have given him my name for a temple prep. class…and this brother has assumed that I’m in the know about said class. The thing is, it would have been nice to be asked first if I wanted to participate.
Anyway, dabbing my toe back in the waters at church in this ward doesn’t seem to be going so well either. I’ve been here three years – and when I was pregnant and extremely ill on bed rest, I called the bishop and asked if someone could just come over and talk with me. I was new in the area and really needed a friend, and one from church would have been wonderful. No-one came. I wanted nothing in the way of meals or housework (I have a very supportive husband) I just wanted someone to talk to because I was sick and so lonely in a new area. I still haven’t had VT’s or HT’s in three years.
I know this has been long – but there’s no simple way to put what I’ve been going through. If anyone can offer me any solutions or different perspectives, I will certainly be open to them.
Thanks if you can help.
AlmostOverIt wrote:There are still many things I love about the church. I love the ideals of family, the common sense and compassion in the words of the general authorities, apostles and prophet. I read and study the materials for Sunday lessons each week, I get the Ensign and Friend delivered to our home.
But I really dislike going to church.
One thing I have learned is that I also feel there is so much about the church I love too…but have my issues about going to church on Sundays regularly. I don’t think it has to be a conflict. I think you can begin to hold on to the wonderful things in the church that help you to be a better person, mother, wife…and let go of some things about the church that don’t fit into your life now.Quote:D&C 50:40 Behold, ye are little children and ye cannot bear all things now; ye must grow in grace and in the knowledge of the truth.
If the Lord knows you can’t do all things at once, and has told us not to run faster than we have strength, than we can be at peace letting go of guilt or fear for what we “should” do. There are some good links on tithing on this website if you use the search function for “tithing” that you can read through…I just think paying tithing is something you have to personally decide if you can or if you just do what you can and be open to the future to take care of itself.I also think there is some risk that if all your contact is dependent on one leader, meaning you go through the Bishop or BP for everything, you can miss out on some great saints in the ward who may be better gifted to be a good friend and support for you.
Without talking bad about the bishop, simply call the RSP or the EQP or HPGL who assigns home teachers, and have a discussion on what you need from them directly…or just another friend in the ward who you talk with. Let them know what you really need (a friend to talk to more than a sermon on tithing). I find most people in the church are eager to help you when they know how they can help.
I think the leaders are just your neighbors. They don’t know anymore than we do about most things, but I still trust they can receive inspiration on how to help us…but I don’t put all my chips on their guidance…I seek guidance from God myself.
Your concerns are very valid. Please keep posting on this site how you are working through things…there are some very good people in this group that can offer words of encouragement. Thanks for posting your thoughts and joining the conversations!
AlmostOverIt wrote:He asked about tithing and I said I pay part-tithe because my husband is not a member and resents any money I pay to the church. The bishop then said that I would need to pay full-tithe to go to the temple, and that he’d send the home teachers around to explain to my husband how important that is. I told him that is a VERY bad idea – home teachers can’t come to our home and tell my non-member husband that we should pay tithing.
Does your husband have to pay tithing for you to to be a full tithe payer? Just asking ’cause I don’t know and was wondering if that is why you’ve declaired yourself to be part-tithe payer.AlmostOverIt wrote:Then last week I get a call from a man I don’t know and have never met. “You are coming to our house tomorrow for temple preparation class”. I said “I am?” and he said “Yes, you are”.
This sounds like a miscommunication to me. The Bishop may have expected the temple prep teacher to tell you about the class and invite you and the TP teacher probally thought the Bishop had already done that.
Heber13 wrote:I also think there is some risk that if all your contact is dependent on one leader, meaning you go through the Bishop or BP for everything
From my experience of having DH be a bishop’s counsellor most of these kinds of things are not delt with by the bishop but delegated out to others.
It sounds like you are trying to be pro-active with things and that’s good. It’s hard to pick up the pieces when they have been broken apart.
I have seen many people heal when they reach out to others. I’m not sure if this is something you would feel you could do but maybe if you were to find ways to reach out to others in this ward it could turn out to be a place you look forward to going to. Maybe there’s someone else new in the area wishing they had a friend to talk to too.
Quote:Does your husband have to pay tithing for you to to be a full tithe payer?
No, a person’s status is a person’s status – and spouses can declare differently.
Right now, my wife and I both work, and we pay tithing as individuals – two separate checks from the same joint account. I will declare my status, and she will declare hers.
What Ray said… I have a good friend in the South whose husband is a non-member. She and her husband have come to an agreement on what they condider her “half” of their income (she doesn’t work) and she pays tithing on that.
She absolutely has a temple recommend. IMHO no bishop or branch president would ever even question that…”are you a full tithe payer?” is a yes/no question….no explanation needed. It’s the individual’s honest opinion that counts.
Quote:IMHO no bishop or branch president would ever even question that…”are you a full tithe payer?” is a yes/no question….no explanation needed. It’s the individual’s honest opinion that counts.
Absolutely. YES!!! YES!!! YES!!!. I feel any attempt by the Bishop to define what a “full tithe” is, is totally wrong. There are to many gray areas that the Church has not ventured into to give the bishop or bp any authority to do it. No business pays taxes on their total sales. They subtract out their expenses for labor and materials. Likewise, you aren’t responsible for your husband’s share. It is what you feel comfortable with, not what the bp does. Talk it over with your husband, for it affects him as well, and then pay what you feel is God would have you do.
Wow, sad to hear that your bishop felt your non-member husband should pay tithe for you to get a temple recommend. That’s crazy. I would say, just decide between you and your spouse what would constitute a fair tithe for you. If you’re not employed, a fair tithe might be zero. Next time you’re asked the question, answer that you are a full tithe payer (assuming you work it out with spouse). Part-tithe gets no recommend, but full tithe can. However, bishop doesn’t need to know the details on how you and spouse arrived on the full-tithe. You indicated that your husband resents money you give to the church. If you are not bringing in money, I would think that titing for you would be zero (though that is for you to decide). If you have a job bringing in money, you could probably either contribute ten percent of that increase or (if you are the primary breadwinner) figure out with spouse what portion might be equated to YOUR increase and contribute based on that amount. Interestingly, anyone can pay their tithing directly to church headquarters without going through the wards. Fast offerings and local missionary funds cannot be paid this way, though. Many members choose this option so others in the ward (clerks, bishops, counselors) don’t know how much they make. You receive a year-end statement from the church and just declare to the bishop your tithing status. Bishop doesn’t have to know how MUCH you paid. I’ve recently started paying tithing in this manner. This method is actually easier on your ward financial clerk and bishop counselors, since that’s one less contribution they have to count each week (or month or quarter or whenever you pay tithing). I still pay fast offerings the normal way, however, so funds stay local.
I think your bishop might be inexperienced, particularly in dealing with part-member families. I would also agree with others suggesting you contact someone besides bishop to request visiting teachers or home teachers or whatever contact you’d like to have. Telling the bishop usually works in most places, sorry to hear that your bishop seems to be dropping the ball in a number of areas. You probably have VT and HTs assigned, but they just are not coming. It’s hard for many people to stretch beyond their comfort zone and initiate contact with people they don’t know, or don’t see regularly at church. My guess is that there are great people in your ward somewhere who would love to help if they knew about it, but the messages just aren’t getting to the right people. Usually, it’s the STPs that do all the good work in any ward and sometimes the bishop is not one of the STPs. (STP = Same Ten People… the ones that do everything… ha).
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