Perhaps revelation is not so confined.

[allquieton]

I was reading Orson’s thread, Who Can Receive Revalation/Prophecy?, and it got me writing down some of my thoughts on the matter.

There is a teaching in the Church that one can only receive revelation for people under their own stewardship. And that individuals can’t receive revelation for the Church. Although this is taught in the Church, I don’t think it is true. Does anyone know if there is a scriptural basis for these ideas?

I disagree mostly because it just doesn’t fit well with what I read in the scriptures, or with what I see in real life.

God gave Samuel a revelation for Eli, who was the Hight Priest. It sounds to me like Eli was the “president” of the Church. (Scholars, am I reading this right?)

Another prophet, Agabus, prophesied what would happen to Paul, who was presumably of higher office in the Church than he. (Acts 21)

Samuel the Lamanite came into Nephite lands and prophesied to the Nephites, even thought they had a perfectly good prophet and church leader (Nephi).

John the Baptist is another one that wasn’t exactly working Church authorities.

I think there is confusion in Church teachings about prophets. In LDS tradition, there is the President of the Church, who is also the Prophet. But in the scriptures, there is no office in the Church of “Prophet”. Prophets seem to be anyone God calls to preach and prophesy. There are often many prophets at the same time, among the same people. They do not necessarily preside over the Church. They can be nobodies.

So, I think an individual can receive revelation for the the Church, or for any other person, great or small. Which, I see could cause some amount confusion. But perhaps it is up to each individual listener to listen to the HG, and sort out the true revelations from the false.

[Anonymous]

Interesting question – and I agree with your separation of “prophet” from “president”. I wonder if a better way to phrase how things work would be “anyone can have revelation about the church, or anyone else. The distinction in my mind IS about stewardship. If I’m not in a leadership position it’s not my job to implement or enforce policy. My revelations, therefore, are but a suggestion or a tidbit of info to the actual leader – as far as his organization is concerned. Hindsight is 20/20, and I think that is the perspective of the scriptures you refer to (whether someone should have listened to someone else) but in the church or any other organization I see leadership protocols a function of order and not exclusively inspiration.

I dunno, just thoughts.

[Anonymous]

There has to be order and structure for any organization to function. Everyone running around saying they had a vision of how we are to proceed would be chaos.

What is revelation is the real question to me. I have ideas that I think would make the church a much better organization, but just becasue I am very convinced I am corrrect does not make them revelation. Likewise a warm or fuzzy feeling is in no way revelation in my mind. Especially when you get to something as grand as the church. If someone other than the prophet claims to have revelation for the whole church they better be telling me a story of how they sat down with Christ and received direct instruction. Of course then I would just think they were a nut case so in reality we are stuck with only the prophet getting revelation after all.

[Anonymous]

I really like the Bible Dictionary description of revelation (bolding added) – which, by the way, is not accepted as official doctrine or revelation (which irony I find delicious):

Quote:

The English word revelation is translated from a Greek word apocalypse, meaning to make known or uncover. This is in contrast to apocrypha, which connotes covered or concealed. Divine revelation is one of the grandest concepts and principles of the gospel of Jesus Christ, for without it, man could not know of the things of God and could not be saved with any degree of salvation in the eternities. Continuous revelation from God to his saints, through the Holy Ghost or by other means, such as vision, dreams, or visitations, makes possible daily guidance along true paths and leads the faithful soul to complete and eternal salvation in the celestial kingdom. The principle of gaining knowledge by revelation is the principle of salvation. It is the making known of divine truth by communication with the heavens, and consists not only of revelation of the plan of salvation to the Lord’s prophets, but also a confirmation in the hearts of the believers that the revelation to the prophets is true. It also consists of individual guidance for every person who seeks for it and follows the prescribed course of faith, repentance, and obedience to the gospel of Jesus Christ. “The Holy Ghost is a revelator,” said Joseph Smith, and “no man can receive the Holy Ghost without receiving revelations” (HC 6: 58). Without revelation, all would be guesswork, darkness, and confusion.

In the Lord’s Church the First Presidency, the Council of the Twelve, and the Patriarch are prophets, seers, and revelators to the Church and to the world. In addition, every person may receive personal revelation for his own benefit. It is contrary to the laws of God for any person to receive revelation for those higher in authority (see D&C 28: 2-8; D&C 100: 11; D&C 107: 91-92).

[Anonymous]

Wow, Ray. I feel like I was just visited by Brother McConkie’s ghost. That was a blast from the past.

[Anonymous]

Boo! (as in a ghostly “boo” – not a derisive “boo” – just realized it could come across either way)

[Author]

Posts