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Holy Cow wrote:Heber13 wrote:
90% of what is on the “approved” buffet menu is stuff I like anyway.
That’s awesome! I’m probably closer to 10%, and I find myself feeling jealous of those who are closer to 90%.
In some ways I am with HC on this one. Even the good stuff like serving your neighbor takes on an taint of stuff I don’t like because of what I see as the motivation for doing it (following rules, ingratiating oneself to God, self-perfection, eternal reward). When I get like that it can help me to look at things like an anthropologist. Rather than get upset at a judgemental black and white teaching – it can help to consider how teachings and rituals fulfill important roles in shaping a community.
Quote:“Bro. KnowItALL is railing against feminists and intellectuals again – how interesting that he tries so hard to defend the conceptual church that he grew up in. I imagine the “us vs. them” mentality helps him to not have to face how the church as he understood it is changing in important ways. How interesting.”
Heber13 wrote:Really??? I’m not saying I don’t believe you…just…surprised. Really??? You only like 10% of all things mormonism? Or am I misunderstanding?
So are you saying when you go to church, 9 out of 10 things that are happening around you are things you don’t like? You don’t have to answer, I’m not saying that is wrong or bad…not trying to pass judgment. Just wondering.
Good question. I should have been more specific. I’m not 10% with EVERYTHING that the church teaches. For example, the basic gospel doctrines (atonement, baptism, service, faith, etc.), I’m 100% on. I completely accept the gospel as it was taught by Christ and presented by the apostles in the New Testament. The stuff that I’m only 10% on would be everything that came from Joseph Smith. Things like polygamy, the Book of Mormon, D&C, P of GP, modern apostles, temple endowments, the first vision story (and all of the other angelic appearances and ordinances). I just have a hard time accepting much that came from him. It’s that 10% of things that came from JS that slightly make sense to me that keep me from jumping ship. I hope that makes sense.
Holy Cow wrote:“Heber13 wrote:Really??? I’m not saying I don’t believe you…just…surprised. Really??? You only like 10% of all things mormonism? Or am I misunderstanding?So are you saying when you go to church, 9 out of 10 things that are happening around you are things you don’t like? You don’t have to answer, I’m not saying that is wrong or bad…not trying to pass judgment. Just wondering.
Good question. I should have been more specific. I’m not 10% with EVERYTHING that the church teaches. For example, the basic gospel doctrines (atonement, baptism, service, faith, etc.), I’m 100% on. I completely accept the gospel as it was taught by Christ and presented by the apostles in the New Testament. The stuff that I’m only 10% on would be everything that came from Joseph Smith. Things like polygamy, the Book of Mormon, D&C, P of GP, modern apostles, temple endowments, the first vision story (and all of the other angelic appearances and ordinances). I just have a hard time accepting much that came from him. It’s that 10% of things that came from JS that slightly make sense to me that keep me from jumping ship. I hope that makes sense.
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I’m pretty much the same, Holy Cow. I don’t know if I can quantify it at a percentage, but I believe Joseph Smith had some type of profound spiritual experience that we know as the First Vision. The rest is all suspect.
Good clarification. I might be around 10% in the stories I hear about Joseph Smith the legend, or other people who have a testimony of the God of Lost Keys. But…I do think that most of Mormonism I hear at church is 70-80% methodist-like teachings about God and the bible and love. Joseph didn’t invent Mormonism ex-nihilo. It was 1830s New England christianity, with a twist of lime, which grew some legs and added some things over the next 50 years even past Joseph’s life. And many others coming in the church influenced doctrine as much as Joseph (or more).
Some things are not what I thought they were being raised in the church and taught some things since Primary. That’s my renewed approach and return to church, by now trying to learn the church teachings with a new set of eyes.
For example, the words “Restoration” and “Translation” are used liberally, I think. I used to think they were literal.
Restoration of the church in Christ’s time? In some way, but it looks more different than alike to the church in Christ’s time (Christ wasn’t teaching polygamy or abstinence from wine).
Translation of ancient documents? In some ways but the end products look more different than alike to the source documents.
I just find most of what I hear in General Conference and what I see at church with fellow saints as very generic religion. Which I can go with, despite my skeptical side of legendary stories, which I have tried to view as allegorical and mystical, not literal, and find the meaning behind the story or the spiritual side of the laws.
Polygamy in the CK? I suppose I will find out since my mom married a widowed man that was sealed to his 1st wife (if they come visit me in a lower kingdom since I am not married in the temple and I haven’t even seen my non member husband in 3 yrs). She is old school TBM so she is fine with it. I suppose my “other mother” is too since my step dad says it was her dying wish for him to remarry.
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