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There is a huge, and growing, anti-corporate sentiment in our country. Especially in the current political climate. Perhaps forcing missionaries to portray white-collar types is not conducive to attracting those that subscribe to it.
It could be percieved as the notion that white-collar is somehow “better” or at least…something that one should aspire to become.
With a pulpit full of business men, I don’t expect that to change anytime soon, however.
Good comments. Ray, I do not think the church has bad or insincere motives when it comes to dress code and perception as far as myself and many Gen x folks.
I just think that the leadership is dominated by corporate and lawyer types, and they are old and don’t understand what the white shirt and suit represent to to Gen xers…they believe it symbolizes reverence and purity and the common man like it use to in the 30-60s.
Sorry. Not so today for most people outside the church. It is not the Good ol days. For many of my generation, white shirts and suits represent greed and corruption. Perhaps if we had some more apostles under the age of 70 they would understand this concept.
Now some might say they do understand this problem or concept, but disagree and choose to stick with the status quo because it works for so many faithful and it’s our brand and cwald be damned.
Fine. But either way…they have no one to blame but themselves about any misconceptions that the church is out of tune with the common man today…because of the way our leaders dress and What we encourage all males to wear to worship and conduct church business.
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What would I substitute? I had a conversation with a good Protestant who pointed out exactly what I just said about perception if the LDS church.
His comments ended with, “do the LDS people worship God on Sunday, or do they worship God EVERYDAY? Maybe if they put less emphasis on appearances and how they dress and look on Sunday, they might be better people and christians all week long when they are not wearing a suit?”
I think he is right. I think we should dress nicely, normal, like the common middle class worker would dress going out to dinner or when company is coming over to visit. Just common decent societal dress standards.
I don’t think we should dress like we are all lawyers, politicians and business executives.
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cwald wrote:I don’t think we should dress like we are all lawyers, politicians and business executives.
In my professional life, white shirts and suits with traditional ties are strongly encouraged as business attire. I hate it, and on Sunday, the last thing I want to do is get into that hot sweaty outfit again. I put on a long-sleeve white shirt and I immediately start sweating.But that’s not the point. I don’t agree with the OP that we need to separate out and create branches for working class people. In denser populations of mormons, this sort of happens naturally by virtue of neighborhood wards, but it still isn’t right.
In one respect, a white shirt is a kind of equalizer, if we could dump the suits. In India, white is a very common color for traditional clothing. Men all wear, from very poorest to the richest, a white shirt with a flat bottom seam and do not tuck it into one’s pants. never a tie. It’s very comfortable and makes things more or less equal. Priesthood leaders in the church and former missionaries get into the suit business, and it’s just hokey in a country that is hot sticky and humid most of the year.
I don’t live in the best neighborhood in the DC area, having the same house I bought 25 years ago…and we have a vibrant mix of all economic backgrounds and work situations. I love it.
cwald, I can’t and won’t argue with your last comments – but I also see it much like wayfarer’s last comment. It’s the suit coats and the money spent on some of them that bothers me the most – not the white shirts and/or ties. Old-Timer wrote:cwald, I can’t and won’t argue with your last comments – but I also see it much like wayfarer’s last comment. It’s the suit coats and the money spent on some of them that bothers me the most – not the white shirts and/or ties.
I propose a standard of short-sleeved white shirts without suit coats for standard summer church attire. Tie can be a traditional tie, bow tie (what I wear), or a bolo.Old-Timer wrote:cwald, I can’t and won’t argue with your last comments – but…
Okay. Carry on folks. Nothing to see here.
As a missionary, I had more success teaching the people from the blue collar crowd than the white collar crowd. So, if I can drop my anti-corporate-in-the church attitude for a moment, I see that religion in general, and our own particular approach to religion DOES appeal to the working class. Now, for leadership positions, I find that the blue collar people tend not to rise up as high. If I was to describe the backgrounds of various Bishops: a) School teacher
b) Shift Supervisor
c) Self-employed person
d) Heating and air conditioning business owner
e) Farm Equipment sales manager
f) 2 Senior Managers from a corporate head office
g) Commercial insurance salesperson
h) University professor
Notice these are all white collar jobs….presumably because these men have shown the abilities that lead to effective leadership which is needed in a Bishop’s role. Which, in my view is an administrative role first and foremost. And white collar jobs tend to be intense in these skills.
And all this is in spite of what I may have written earlier as I’m now trying to look at this objectively based on the actual facts in my life experience.
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