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It is being reported that the LDS Church is ending its involvement with the older Scouting programs (Varsity and Venturing: 14-17 years old), effective January 1, 2018. So, the church has finally announced that it will end it’s scouting program for boys 14 and over, as of this coming January. Cubs and boys younger than 14 will continue to be involved in scouting. I think this will put the YM and YW programs on a much more even playing field, and I think it’s a great move. However, I also think scouting is good for YM. I think it’s completely over-priced, but still a good program. At the same time, I’m glad the church is going to do it’s own thing going forward for the 14+ boys. Personally, I’ll probably keep my son in scouting, rather than having him focus on the church’s program. I’m happy to pay for his scouting dues myself. It will be interesting to see what kind of program the church comes up with, but I hope it isn’t too heavy on the spiritual aspect. YM and YW both need activities that are just focused on personal growth, outside of ‘faith-building.’ This item is in Mormon Newsroom today: http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/questions-answers-changes-young-men-program ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/questions-answers-changes-young-men-program There is a link to a PDF letter from the FP on the site and a link to a new YM activities site:
https://www.lds.org/youth/ymactivities?lang=enghttps://www.lds.org/youth/ymactivities?lang=eng” class=”bbcode_url”> I am supportive of Scouting in that it is a good program for those who like it and want to be a part of it. Two of my sons are Eagle Scouts.
I am also supportive of this initiative on multiple levels. I think it is great for those YM with little interest in Scouting (which in some places appears to be a majority) and I think it takes a step in the right direction as far as “equalizing” the programs between YM and YW (including financially).
I am a little surprised honestly, and I wonder if this is a “letting down gently” situation where the rest of Scouting will follow suit in a couple years.
Thoughts?
Where was it announced? Is there any further explanation?
Seems like a good move overall in terms of increased parity between thr YM and YW programs. A couple unanswered questions in my mind:
– What about boys 14 and over who want to earn their eagle but haven’t yet? The press release says they will continue to be registered and encouraged and supported, but who will register them and what troop will they be a part of?
– If the BSA moves to include girls, will girls under 14 be allowed or encouraged to be a part of the BSA?
I think the church will completely separate from the BSA once they have a universal global program in place for YM and YW. My understanding is that they are working on building one. My fear is that program will be overly focused on faith building (i.e., indoctrinating or “sin proofing”) and that it will lose the interest of the youth.
Shouldn’t all boys earn their Eagle by age 14 anyway? 🙄 Is this really much of a change? From what I’ve seen in my ward the kids already don’t do scouts starting at around that age. They’ll do an occasional venture scouting campout but mutual night has nothing to do with scouts.
To me this sounds like formalizing in policy what has been practice for a long time.
This has got to be the beginning of the end for Cub/Boy Scouts in the Church: – Reaching Eagle Scout is going to be much less common. Currently, it’s rare for 13-year-olds to make Eagle. Most come from the 14-16 group and the second most from the 16-17 group (anecdotal evidence only). Now, after 14, it sounds like you are on your own to complete advancement, with ‘assistance’ from the local unit. That is sort of the
de factoway it works today, but will now have less emphasis from the Church. Consider the text from the FP Letter: Quote:Young men over the age of 14
who desire to continue to work towardthe rank of Eagle Scout or Queen Scout [Canada] should be encouraged and supported in their efforts and should be properly registered as Scouts. – 14+ young men will need to be part of a non-church Varsity/Venturing unit in order to keep advancing. From the FP Letter:
Quote:The Church will no longer charter Varsity or Venturing units.
This is pretty big for a few reasons. The boys in the LDS troops are usually viewed as being pretty lacking in scouting. They tend to check boxes but not really live it the way non-LDS troops do. For an LDS kid to go to a non-LDS Varsity/Venturing unit is going to be an eye-opener and much more demanding in terms of completing the Eagle Rank (IMO). LDS parents are much less likely to sign their son up for an external LDS group.
– There was a very interesting item in the Church’s Q&A:
Quote:Question: Will the disparity of funding and activities that exists between the Church’s Young Men and Young Women programs be addressed as part of this change?
Answer: Church leaders have long been aware of this concern. This new program brings the spending into balance for youth ages 14 through 18. This
will continue to be a factor in the ongoing exploration and creation of a worldwide youth program.In each congregation, the ward council is encouraged to consider equally the needs of Young Women and Young Men and their families when planning activities and determining budgets.
nibbler wrote:
Shouldn’t all boys earn their Eagle by age 14 anyway?🙄 Is this really much of a change? From what I’ve seen in my ward the kids already don’t do scouts starting at around that age. They’ll do an occasional venture scouting campout but mutual night has nothing to do with scouts.
To me this sounds like formalizing in policy what has been practice for a long time.
Neither of my boys earned their Eagle by 14, and it’s rare in our ward that anyone does. I also note both of my boys attended non-church troops for some time, but that was actually in their earlier years when our Scouting program was in a shambles. One of them did continue to do activities with the other troop after we got a new SM in the ward. They were both also interested in Scouting and like outdoor activities, etc.
And, our Mutual nights do center on Scouts. What happens is that boys who aren’t interested in Scouts just don’t come. This new program might change that and it’s one of the positives I see in it. I do recognize that in other places it’s different and Mutual night (I actually wish they’d change the name of that) for boys is often just basketball night. Again, I see the change to having a formal activity outline as positive but I also think those wards that have weak or uninterested YMPs will continue to have basketball night.
Our YM program is very small. We have no active priests, one active teacher (who is close to earning his Eagle), and three active deacons (I think one is 13). It’ll be hard to implement this program for one or two kids. Our Scout troop includes several non-member boys. That brings up another whole question – what will become of them? There are some over 14.
On Own Now wrote:
For an LDS kid to go to a non-LDS Varsity/Venturing unit is going to be an eye-opener and much more demanding in terms of completing the Eagle Rank (IMO). LDS parents are much less likely to sign their son up for an external LDS group.
This is a great point. LDS troops tend to be pretty relaxed compared to non-LDS troops. And, that’s exactly why I would prefer to keep my son in a non-LDS troop, rather than focusing on whatever the church’s program will be. I’m sure the LDS program will have some kind of awards and rank advancements that the church will push, as well. But, I would much rather push my son to get the Eagle Scout award from a non-LDS troop, than have him spend all his time working towards an LDS-focused program that provides awards and ranks that mean nothing outside of the LDS realm.
DarkJedi wrote:
And, our Mutual nights do center on Scouts. What happens is that boys who aren’t interested in Scouts just don’t come. This new program might change that and it’s one of the positives I see in it. …I think it will create an interesting dynamic. There are boys that aren’t interested in scouting but I’d venture (pun?) that there are even less boys that would be interested in showing up on a weeknight to do duty to god stuff.
It depends on what they replace scouting with. I’ll have to start paying attention to what our ward currently does. All I know is that the scouting portion of mutual is over when you become a teacher in the AP (in my ward).
Too funny not to share. Spotted on FB: Quote:Am I the only one wondering how all these LDS parents are going to hold off letting their son’s get their drivers license? Because they all use the Eagle Scout card as the excuse they use, but we all know it’s because they are terrified of letting their boys behind the wheel.
It sounds like gradual change toward the church’s own program. If I had my son involved in scouts, I would want him going to a community troop rather than a church one anyway. In my area of the world there is far too much instability, poor training and lack of commitment from many leaders. Bishops also call scout leaders to other callings when they need them, and of course, you have the “duty” factor/conscription model that can hurt commitment of leaders. People doing it in the community are often there because they wanna be there, in my experience. I agree that most boys will be less likely to show up for a Duty to God thing on Wednesday night than basketball (and in many cases Scouts). We used to have a YW leader in our ward who thought the YM and YW programs ought to be the same, that is emphasizing the more “spiritual” aspects of things. She also thought camp for YM should be like YW camp. She clearly didn’t get that boys and girls are very different from each other at that age and (at least in my experience) have very little interest in touchy-feely “spiritual” activities for an evening or a week. There is a page linked to the announcement with new program activities.
https://www.lds.org/youth/ymactivities?lang=enghttps://www.lds.org/youth/ymactivities?lang=eng” class=”bbcode_url”>
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