- This topic is empty.
-
Posts
-
I’ve known about this for a while, but frankly I’ve been a little hesitant to post it. I don’t know why I’m hesitant, actually because I agree with what she says. I get out of this that in the end we all get the same reward, male or female. So here it is for your viewing and discussion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QYlDLChzig&feature=youtu.be ” class=”bbcode_url”> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QYlDLChzig&feature=youtu.be I think you are hesitant for one reason: What men and women get is a deeply emotional topic / issue, and you don’t want to start a flame war.
I haven’t seen the video yet, but, as an admin, let’s be honest but as charitable as possible in the comments, please.
I have seen this video. I guess my discouragement comes from the question I have on why, even though women “get” these things, are our husbands assigned to Preside over us? It feels like a slap in the face sometimes for me. I guess when I watch this, it seems like an apologetic video. It’s like “Hey! Look at how much you get compared to other churches?” Although we may get these things, men still primarily Preside over women. Inequality is a society problem, and I am happy the church seems to allow more opportunities for women, but in my mind, we have a long way to go. I don’t feel any better after watching it, and I watched it again, just for you. 
That video is a joke. I have nothing charitable to say about it or about Sis. Dew. This is the Uncle Tom approach for Mormon women. I hope this approach comes off balanced – I am glad we posted it here. It has been floating out for a while and is part of the conversation. I also am very appreciative of Sheri Dew and much of her work. I have three personal letters from her, that we exchanged years ago when she was in the General Relief Society. I am so glad she was the first single sister in the General Relief Society. I loved her snappy style of communication. It was breath of inspiring air, so often we are spoken to like Primary children. A soft whispery voice, a bit sing songy. Sheri Dew has none of that. I also believe she knows the struggle of women in certain areas. Single – all of her friends married. Not having the standard Mormon Wife life. She has acknowledged the years of struggle with that pain. Yes she is presently in a position of authority, but that wasn’t guaranteed, so I believe she has empathy for second class feelings. With all of that I, as well as my aversion to OW, I do have some struggles. Yes it is comforting to hope that in the next life everyone, and I mean everyone, will have equal opportunities, experiences, so on. I am sure blind people, crippled people and so on will appreciate the ease they receive. But I am not certain that some of the pain presently experienced by women in our religion needs to wait till later. Here is where I struggle. Sheri Dew is a historian by degree. That was her college major. She is smart, well read, and has access to a lot of information – and knows how to research if she has a question. Her answer, in my opinion, negates history. The bible references 2 prophetesses. Miriam, Moses sister – who is in the first presidency. And Deborah, whom the Isrealites seek out to know where/how to prepare and win battle. (For all of LOTR fans, I picture Deborah like Galadryl). Smattered along the New Testament are other women with Prophetic and Priestess callings. Yes – it does happen in the temple, but not day to day.
Where this waiting until next time begins to chafe is in Priesthood roulette. Some years ago I was the Stake Young Womens President, and I watched, in horror as a Stake President verbally dressed down and dismissed an idea that Stake Relief Presidency had fasted, prayed, taken to the Temple for consideration – and was cut out in front of the entire high council and auxiliaries. Not that there should ever be retribution, but a woman will never get to do that in this church.
On the final note of baby bearers and priesthood. (I know Sheri Dew did not talk about this. I am responding to RiverSong on this. Hello Swweettie
In short, yes we do get. We are not totally washed out as some cultures do to women, but our Pioneer Ancestors were on the cutting edge of feminism – before feminism was even a word. They voted, they laid hands on heads and animals – with full healing rights, they were sent off by their leader to gain education in science, medicine. They wrote their own magazines, They (the girls) selected the hymns, the ran their own Society/Branch of the church. We have lost that. So yes we get, but we got more before.
I get that it’s apologetic/party line/Uncle Tom, and I don’t agree with everything she says (I don’t agree with everything Pres. Monson says either). I really like the part where she talks about our eternal reward though – which she says will be the same for all of us. I’m sure she didn’t mean it exactly the way I have interpreted it, but since my view is of a merciful Good full of grace who sees each of us as individuals I interpret it to mean we are all exalted in our own right. FWIW, I don’t buy the whole temple thing about women being subservient to their husbands. I respect Sherri Dew for her accomplishments and her positive outlook. But I disagree with her when it comes to this issue. She has a lot of influence. I am sad to see her use it in this way. What I learned in the temple is that my husband and I do not get the same thing in the end. We are running the same race, but at the end he gets a great big shiny golden trophy. I get a ‘participant’ ribbon, but I’m supposed to feel like my husband’s trophy (with his name engraved on it and mine nowhere to be seen) is enough of a prize for me. I think she skirts the issue. You can toss most of her points away by saying “men can do all of those things and…” where things that come after the word “and” show where the inequalities lie. She mentions that she has served on presidencies in the church. My first thought: those presidencies are still under the direction of men. I also thought, well all presidencies in the church are under similar constraints. In some ways this goes back to Oaks’ talk. EQs & BPs > SP > AP > GA > etc > Prophet. So all presidencies are under the direction of a man… but that’s a key point. Always under the direction of a man.
Writing a biography? Meeting with other sisters all over the world over? I don’t see how those hold a place in this argument.
Pray in public, teach, be a missionary. For better or for worse I boiled those points down to “others treat women even worse” which is never a good justification for not improving. We shouldn’t be comparing ourselves to others, we should be comparing ourselves against the ideal.
It’s really nothing but I thought it was a bit unfortunate that she emphasized the word
commandedwhen she talks about Emma getting the opportunity to expound scripture. Woman, commanded. I’m sure that’s my bias. Most of the D&C is men being commanded to do this and that. Still the lean on the word “commanded” stood out. She did touch on the important role of women bearing children. I’d like to see the debate move away from priesthood for men, babies for women. An appeal to gender roles doesn’t add much for me..
I’m not sure what the venue was but she used an interesting style. Retelling one side of a debate where she presents herself as the clear and obvious “winner.” It reminded me of televangelists.
I agree with Joni, and I also agree with nibbler that everything I hear from Sis Dew boils down to “women are treated far worse in other cultures.” That’s true, and I’m aware of it, but it still doesn’t make it right, and for her (a woman) to say it really pisses me off. I have seen the axe, and the handle is one of us. I am beyond sick and tired of hearing the nonsense about motherhood being so so so important and our consolation prize for not really being allowed to fully participate like men do in our Mormon decision making bodies. Men being fathers = women being mothers.
hawkgrrrl wrote:That video is a joke. I have nothing charitable to say about it or about Sis. Dew. This is the Uncle Tom approach for Mormon women.
Misogyny, with a smile, is still misogyny.Good responses so far. Mom3…a fellow Whovian?! I appreciated your comments very much. I am sorry about your daughter. My heart goes out to her. 
RiverSong – You bet your Sonic Screw Driver. Quote:It’s bigger on the inside.
Add our family to the list of Whovians – at least all six of our kids. Joni wrote:What I learned in the temple is that my husband and I do not get the same thing in the end. We are running the same race, but at the end he gets a great big shiny golden trophy. I get a ‘participant’ ribbon, but I’m supposed to feel like my husband’s trophy (with his name engraved on it and mine nowhere to be seen) is enough of a prize for me.
I realize that I cannot possibly understand the female point of view on this, but truth is I don’t get that out of the temple. Yes, I hear the words, but I am not at all focused on those words or most of the others. To share another point related to this, I do not believe that we will be asked at any point to actually give any of those signs or tokens on our way to heaven – I don’t think they’re real. I don’t think most of the other stuff in the temple is real, either – it’s made up by men. Is there symbolism in the temple? Yes, I do believe so. Any covenants we make with God are between us individually and God and I think have little to do with bowing your head and saying yes while everyone else is doing the same thing. Just to be perfectly clear, I do not believe God puts us under any sort of covenant where women are subservient to men, and I do not believe my reward (or any other man’s) will be different from any woman’s. I don’t believe God works that way – and Sherri Dew did not say anything like that in this presentation.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.