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http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings I don’t think I learned anything new from this article except that GAs sign a form vowing not to share their journals, etc. It’s sad that we probably won’t see journals since Kimball, but I see why the church is doing it. Were these private thoughts to be made public, we’d see a few things:
1. Despite the PR department’s assertion that the brethren are completely united and in perfect harmony at all times, we’d see that what some of the brethren say is more correct – that they have disagreements and vigorous discussions.
2. We’d see that sometimes they are wrong about things – blacks and the priesthood, for example.
3. We might even realize that not all of them (and maybe none of them) have seen Christ.
I think the article is a good read from the perspective of the various historians quoted.
Interesting. At one point I heard that current leaders were counseled to not keep journals of any kind. Why leaders’ journals are secret… to me it’s obvious, that’s where all the juiciest of secrets are to be found.
Of course it immediately conjures up thoughts of a conspiracy, the “what are they hiding” thoughts are a natural response to something like this. On the other hand I wouldn’t want a million people reading my personal journal. Thank goodness I’ll never be famous. Forget keeping journals under lock and key, I’d burn all my mission journals right now.
I think you mean “sacred,” not “secret.” 😆 Joni wrote:I think you mean “sacred,” not “secret.”
😆 Nope, said what I meant and meant what I said!
Joni: You made me laugh.
DarkJedi wrote:http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings 1. Despite the PR department’s assertion that the brethren are completely united and in perfect harmony at all times, we’d see that what some of the brethren say is more correct – that they have disagreements and vigorous discussions.
This is ludicrous. If the PR department says this, they are bald face liars.
From what I have read and understand, this is NOT the case. Even up until BKP passed, there were problems and disagreements. Has something happened where all of the sudden there is perfect harmony?
I want to see that assertion in writing. I suspect any statement doesn’t actually say that. I have seen some of what was disclosed in the Bill Clinton / Tony Blair conversations that were forced to be made public. I am glad the journals are kept private – and, in this case, “private” is a much better description that “secret”.
Rob4Hope wrote:DarkJedi wrote:http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings 1. Despite the PR department’s assertion that the brethren are completely united and in perfect harmony at all times, we’d see that what some of the brethren say is more correct – that they have disagreements and vigorous discussions.
This is ludicrous. If the PR department says this, they are bald face liars.
From what I have read and understand, this is NOT the case. Even up until BKP passed, there were problems and disagreements. Has something happened where all of the sudden there is perfect harmony?
I believe that DJ is saying that the church has made significant efforts to portray a united front on issues.
Roy wrote:Rob4Hope wrote:DarkJedi wrote:http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings 1. Despite the PR department’s assertion that the brethren are completely united and in perfect harmony at all times, we’d see that what some of the brethren say is more correct – that they have disagreements and vigorous discussions.
This is ludicrous. If the PR department says this, they are bald face liars.
From what I have read and understand, this is NOT the case. Even up until BKP passed, there were problems and disagreements. Has something happened where all of the sudden there is perfect harmony?
I believe that DJ is saying that the church has made significant efforts to portray a united front on issues.
I understand this, and no offense to DJ. But, this opens up another concern for me…..when the PR department tries to push the line of
harmony, and from what I have read this is pretty far from the case,…at what point does that stretching of the line start to become dishonest? It bothers me when things are said that seem disharmonious with what the gospel teaches, especially about honesty. Is heaven like this?….we just stretch things until we make them seem like what we want? And, from what I recollect, BKP often changed his vote SIMPLY BECAUSE they needed to move forward, and unless he changed, there was no way to proceed. But, is this harmony?…changing your vote simply to get something done when you disagree inside about the choice? (not to mention the times when arguments have been shut down by the prophet telling people to back off and mind)
Roy wrote:Rob4Hope wrote:DarkJedi wrote:http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.sltrib.com/lifestyle/faith/3386750-155/why-top-mormon-leaders-private-writings 1. Despite the PR department’s assertion that the brethren are completely united and in perfect harmony at all times, we’d see that what some of the brethren say is more correct – that they have disagreements and vigorous discussions.
This is ludicrous. If the PR department says this, they are bald face liars.
From what I have read and understand, this is NOT the case. Even up until BKP passed, there were problems and disagreements. Has something happened where all of the sudden there is perfect harmony?
I believe that DJ is saying that the church has made significant efforts to portray a united front on issues.Yes. I don’t have a ton of time, but I do want to respond. From the FairMormon presentation by Michael Otterson (church PR) last August (
http://www.fairmormon.org/perspectives/fair-conferences/2015-fairmormon-conference/on-the-record ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.fairmormon.org/perspectives/fair-conferences/2015-fairmormon-conference/on-the-record Quote:There are no factions among the Twelve. I have been in those meetings enough to see the diversity of opinions and different perspectives aired and thoroughly talked through. My experience is that unless the Brethren are united on something, the issue just doesn’t move forward. They always go for unity, complete unity, which is what you’d expect in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Otterson admits there are different perspectives and I like that he did make that point. I liked the presentation as a whole and his general candor. He also makes the point that they don’t move forward without
complete unity. I concede that I overgeneralized in asserting that PR says they are in complete unity at all times – but in policy changes Otterson asserts they are indeed in complete unity. I don’t think Pres. Nelson thinks he is saying anything he thinks we don’t already believe in his statements about the gay policy – he made an effort to make us aware that the brethren present perceived this policy change as a revelation and are united. I am not an apostle and will never be one. I am also not a business leader, lawyer, doctor, or college president. However, sometimes I do have opinions when I’m sitting in council that I keep to myself in that setting but might share elsewhere (such as here under the guise of anonymity). If I kept a journal, I would likely reflect upon our meetings and write my true thoughts and feelings on subjects we discuss which may be very different from the outcome of the meeting. Will I go forth and do what I am expected to do? Sure, I’ll present the talk or lesson as a representative of the stake president in a way that I think he would approve – even if I disagree with some of it (and in reality I emphasize what I agree with and don’t emphasize what I question or disagree with). Only someone I have confided in, which is sometimes done here, knows the difference. I think the journals of some GAs may be like this – they likely write things about their feelings and thoughts in a journal that they would not necessarily share in a council or other setting. What I was trying to say in point one was that if these journals were to be made public people might see that just because there appears to be a united front there could still be differences of opinion and perhaps not even complete agreement – and I don’t think PR wants us to believe that.
I can understand the need for privacy, but if some of the late leaders had kept journals, why couldn’t any of those ever become available? I was taught to keep journals for you and your future prosperity, because they could be used for scripture. That’s what I remember being taught.
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