Struggling

[Anonymous]

Welcome, Dkormond! Happy to have you with us.

I think we share a lot of the same issues with the Church. Both science and Church history (or religious history in general) is dismissed by the Church (and most religions in general), because it’s damaging to their cause. It’s pretty obvious to me that “revelation” is a terrible predictor of things as they were, are, and will be. The religious have too often been outraged at scientific advancement, whether it’s the discovery that the world is flat, that each star is it’s own sun with its own planet, that creatures in “God’s perfect creation” can go extinct… the list goes on. Western Religions cannot admit they are wrong, because it would ruin their credibility. As a result, they deny for as long as they can, and then either reframe the prophecy, or dismiss it as “personal opinion”, to keep their claims to “truth”. It’s not a healthy way to live.

Dkormond wrote:

One last clarification/elucidation. I’ll share the story because I hope for insight. As I said I work with children. I have a family I work with where dad was abusive. The mother divulged the abuse to her bishop. The bishop told the Stake President who called the father. The father went home and sodomized the mom and beat her in retaliation. Years ago my ex assaulted me in front of our children. I filed for a protective order. My bishop called me when he found out. At our next court hearing, to my surprise, my bishop was there to testify against me and divulged our conversation. I contacted my Stake President and the church and the next thing I knew I was receiving letters from The church’s attorneys demanding that I not contact any more church authorities regarding the incident. I never received anything close to an apology from the church or the local leaders. I see similar events to this regularly in my work. Perhaps all of my skepticism is just anger.

That’s MESSED UP! I’ve known a couple of men in similar situations. Whether in the the Church courts or matters of law, there is EXTREME sexism against men. I also feel like with many Church leaders, their “Mandate of Heaven” goes to their head. Whatever they do and however they feel is inspired; and as a result, they struggle to empathize and to THINK before they act. When it comes to trust, you’ve got to be able to trust the individual and not the position. Being “called by revelation” is honestly a pretty poor credential.

I still have hope; the Church has many wonderful qualities and teaches many nobel truths. Despite all it’s shenanigans, I still love it very much. It can change, and absolutely will in order to survive. But because of the way it is organized, run, and a few key paradigms it holds, change take a VERY long time to happen. We just need to be patient, I think.

[Anonymous]

LookingHard wrote:

For me this site has been invaluable, but it isn’t working for me long term. But I am very grateful for this site and the folks here. It helped me from exploding out of the church and damaging relationships. There is some great wisdom here.

And having watched this site and others, I have seen a trend that tells me I am not alone. MANY people come for a while and eventually feel they have to be more “honest” and say, “I don’t believe.”

For some reason, this has worked for me long term. Can you tell me why it’s not working for you long term LookingHard? I am interested in understanding why it works for some people long term, and not for others.

I also wonder what people who “come out” with their unbelief end up doing with their lives afterwards, as they don’t post here very much — so there is very little closure.

I know that AmateurParent came out, and doesn’t attend, and no longer considers herself a Mormon, but she has retained her membership — but how is it going with life in general? Spirituality? Family who are still in the church? These are the things we rarely hear about and that I would find interesting. Same with TurinTurnabar (I think I have his username wrong). He came here trying to stay given same sex attraction and then decided it didn’t work, so we rarely hear from him.

The thing about StayLDS is we’re interested in a long term relationship here online even if the member of the forum decides to break ties with the church. It’s not like relationships at church where you fade away after you stop coming. There is ongoing interest in how it’s going — a least, from my perspective.

[Anonymous]

Dkormond wrote:

Years ago my ex assaulted me in front of our children. I filed for a protective order. My bishop called me when he found out. At our next court hearing, to my surprise, my bishop was there to testify against me and divulged our conversation.

I’m simply appalled at your bishop’s handling of the situation. That goes well beyond the seriousness of the leadership roullette problems I have personally dealt with. I think it’s incredibly sad (and sexist) that your bishop sided with your wife. Our society simply does not take female on male domestic abuse seriously.

There are bad leaders in the church and there are BAD leaders in the church. I am so sorry you had to deal with what you did.

This all really puts you between a rock and a hard place. I hope you can find peace and direction here.

[Anonymous]

SilentDawning wrote:

LookingHard wrote:

For me this site has been invaluable, but it isn’t working for me long term. But I am very grateful for this site and the folks here. It helped me from exploding out of the church and damaging relationships. There is some great wisdom here.

And having watched this site and others, I have seen a trend that tells me I am not alone. MANY people come for a while and eventually feel they have to be more “honest” and say, “I don’t believe.”

For some reason, this has worked for me long term. Can you tell me why it’s not working for you long term LookingHard? I am interested in understanding why it works for some people long term, and not for others.

Let me think on that just a bit and get back with a bit more thought.

[Anonymous]

Dkormond, Welcome to the club!

I think there are a lot of people who can relate to feeling like they need to stay for the social implications. It can be hard to leave when you know that it would impact relationships that you value. But, you’ve found an understanding group of people here, and I hope you can find some peace in being able to share your thoughts here.

Quote:

I also wonder what people who “come out” with their unbelief end up doing with their lives afterwards, as they don’t post here very much — so there is very little closure.

SD, this is an interesting thought. I know I’ve found myself posting less and less as time goes on, even though I still check the site once or twice every day. For me, going public has opened up other sources of support. I’m very open about my lack of faith in different issues with my family, friends, and church members. I’ve talked about it in sacrament meeting, sunday school, priesthood meeting. I have lunches with my EQ President on a fairly regular basis, where we talk about our different viewpoints of various gospel topics. He knows I have very little faith in most Mormon-specific doctrines, but he still asked me to teach a lesson in EQ when the regular teacher was gone. So, finding other sources to talk about things has diminished the need to seek support here.

In the beginning, this site is the only thing that kept me in the church. I would have left without the support I found here. But, as my faith has changed, I now find that I have a stronger relationship with God, completely independent from the church. So, when I see posts about problems with church leaders (local or top leaders), church culture, church history, church doctrines/rules, etc., those posts don’t speak to me the way they used to. I’ve come to a point where I don’t really care what church leaders say, or what the church teaches, or what happened in the church’s history. I follow Christ’s gospel, not the church. The church can go in any direction it wants; I go my own way. Cutting the church out as a mediator between myself and God has taken all of the power away from the church that I used to give it.

[Anonymous]

Dkormond wrote:

Thanks everyone. Do you feel like denying your truth has a long term negative affect on your soul?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I do not feel like I deny my truth. I do feel that I have come to a point where I recognize that my truth is not going to be well received and may even be unwelcome at church. Sometimes there are ways to say something tactfully in a SS discussion and have some people consider a different point of view. This can be a skill of determining appropriate time, place, audience, and presentation. Not everyone has this skillset or social capital to pull it off. ( I consider myself a work in progress in this regard)

I also feel that there is sometimes a limit to how much I can listen to things that contradict my truth. When I recognize that I am getting closer to my limit I may tune out with a book or tablet device or I may physically leave the room (like I am going to the rest room.)

Finally, I really am ok with people believing differently than I do – especially if their beliefs are not overtly harmful to themselves or others.

[Anonymous]

Dkormond wrote:

Thanks everyone. Do you feel like denying your truth has a long term negative affect on your soul?

A girl in church who was mysteriously very easy to talk to had a temporary tatoo on her wrist today that said “Not all who wander are lost” – the Tolkien quote. As I noticed it, I saw a new perspective to the quote that I could relate to.

Just because you are asking questions that ostensibly no one else is doesn’t mean you are in apostasy. You may come to embrace new ideas as part of your faith journey. See it as moving forward and maturing in your faith. If it leads you to leave, I respect and validate your decision. I believe that God understands and will not hold it against you, if done for the right reasons.

[Anonymous]

Reminded me of this image:

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1940&p=111187#p111187” class=”bbcode_url”>viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1940&p=111187#p111187

[Author]

Posts