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I got the below information on another forum from a member that lives in the Netherlands. A tax court in the Netherlands ruled that people that receive fast offerings will have that amount deducted from their Social Security Payments. This will happen even when the church pays the rent or utilities directly. The church will also have to pay tax on payments to or on behalf of members.
This has other repercussions, because being a charity in Holland means no-one who gives a donation is allowed to benefit from the work of said charity by law.
So the Church is now in trouble with the Dutch Tax Office for all the “benefits” they have paid to members who had made charitable donations to the church.
Missionary visas are being looked at as a possible way of “punishment”.
Please provide a link to a story about this. There is no way to discuss this intelligently without a proper source. Yes, I know. All I have is the second hand information from the member. I’ve asked him for more information. Though I’m afraid all the documentation will be in Dutch. We’ll need somebody to translate it for us. Sheldon wrote:Yes, I know. All I have is the second hand information from the member. I’ve asked him for more information. Though I’m afraid all the documentation will be in Dutch. We’ll need somebody to translate it for us.
Google translate can be fun in situations like this!
DarkJedi wrote:Google translate can be fun in situations like this!
Haha… As an experiment, I used google translate on your OP to Dutch and then back to English, though I did make a stop in Telegu. This should help clarify it:Quote:Fast submissions to the court in the Netherlands as a tax on the amount that will be deducted from their Social Security benefits to be received by the people . Rent or utilities paid directly to the municipality , and it happens. Will have to pay taxes or payments for the benefit of the members of the church .
Anyone can give a charitable donation in the Netherlands by the law as a means to benefit from the work of the charity is the other consequences .
So that church donations . Paid to the members of all the “benefits ” of the Dutch authorities, is in trouble
Missionary visas “punishment” can be seen as a way out .
I can’t find anything through Google about this. However, I did find an article from last October about Scientology being given tax-exempt status. Given that decision, I will suspend comment until we have an official story to discuss.
This is an example of bad law. It’s a mess and doesn’t understand the situation. But there is always the possibility someone wanted to get back at the church for the gay marriage thing! (That’s happened with a certain politician here.)
I’d read the same on the NOM forum. It sounds more like rumour/hearsay than anything else at the moment. Interesting if true. Seems the LDS are under the microscope a bit in Europe at the moment.
It’s an interesting question though – if someone is getting state income support/benefits due to either incapacity/no job – is it OK for them to receive regular income from other sources and not declare it?
Social benefits are obviously low, but they are calculated based on the assumption you have no other income. If it’s not ok for someone to do some “cash-in-hand” work and not declare it, is it OK for them to receive a monthly “income” from the church?
mackay11 wrote:I’d read the same on the NOM forum. It sounds more like rumour/hearsay than anything else at the moment.
Interesting if true. Seems the LDS are under the microscope a bit in Europe at the moment.
It’s an interesting question though – if someone is getting state income support/benefits due to either incapacity/no job – is it OK for them to receive regular income from other sources and not declare it?
Social benefits are obviously low, but they are calculated based on the assumption you have no other income. If it’s not ok for someone to do some “cash-in-hand” work and not declare it, is it OK for them to receive a monthly “income” from the church?
Pardon my ignorance, but what happens in the US in cases like this? When one applies for welfare, food stamps, whatever, does assistance from a church or other non profit (like a food bank) need to be declared?
DarkJedi wrote:mackay11 wrote:I’d read the same on the NOM forum. It sounds more like rumour/hearsay than anything else at the moment.
Interesting if true. Seems the LDS are under the microscope a bit in Europe at the moment.
It’s an interesting question though – if someone is getting state income support/benefits due to either incapacity/no job – is it OK for them to receive regular income from other sources and not declare it?
Social benefits are obviously low, but they are calculated based on the assumption you have no other income. If it’s not ok for someone to do some “cash-in-hand” work and not declare it, is it OK for them to receive a monthly “income” from the church?
Pardon my ignorance, but what happens in the US in cases like this? When one applies for welfare, food stamps, whatever, does assistance from a church or other non profit (like a food bank) need to be declared?
As Branch Pres a few years ago I had some people receiving a regular monthly donation. They were on benefits but the welfare topped them up. I don’t think they declared it. Is that morally wrong? I’m not sure. I don’t think there’s a legal obligation. If, on the other hand, they were doing work that was cash in hand then they should declare it (and lose appropriate benefits). I wonder whether that’s why they stopped asking people to do service projects (e.g. tend the chapel grounds) for welfare payments as they did in the past. Maybe the tax office pointed out they were effectively doing a paid job.
EDIT: Apparently this is actually the case. You should declare charitable contributions in UK:
http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/experts/article-2520843/How-big-gift-accept-welfare-affected.html Also, in UK:
“Your household income can affect how much income-based JSA you get. Income includes money from savings (if you have more than £6,000), pensions and earnings.”
https://www.gov.uk/jobseekers-allowance/eligibility It doesn’t specify charity receipts, but the other article does. Income from £6,000 savings is tiny. Only £300/year. I wonder if that’s the maximum for charity receipts.
This topic has peaked my interest. I am now curious if anyone knows the rationale behind this? The more I think about it the more I think, “why give to a charity?” if the state counts accepting help from a charity as a means of deducting their own support, I think I will adjust my thinking to the idea that my taxes are charity. (Don’t get me wrong, I can see how receiving funds from a charity can be abused, just donate everything to a charity and have it give it back to you.) I thought the whole point of a charitable contribution was me deciding how my money was spent. I don’t know maybe someone can help me with this thought process. I think it was originally to avoid corruption in charities, or for them to be turned into a banking substitute. I suspect though the church’s regular anti-gay comments have probably set a few backs up in the Dutch government though.
I looked at the two links – didn’t seem to be about Mormonism, but I don’t understand Dutch well. (I work it out through German and English) The info is about the law, generally. The LDS Church is not mentioned in either link – and there is nothing in the info at either link that would suggest the LDS Church would be in trouble in any way for distributing fast offering assistance to members. If there is a reporting need that is not being met, it isn’t mentioned in the information in the links.
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