The Great Contradiction

[Anonymous]

+1 What Ray said (about what Brian said 🙂 )…

I have experienced angst when reading church history things. Interestingly, continuing to read has given me less angst, as I’ve been choosy on what to read and what not to. Negative stuff hasn’t helped me, positive stuff does. I have found A LOT of positive stuff outside of mormonism that has helped me stay with mormonism (Buddhism, new age philosophy) as I balance it with respectable mormon reading (General Conference, James Talmage, Richard Bushman, Lowell Bennion).

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My question is can I enjoy the good aspects of the church without having a true “testimony” that it’s the only “true church”?

My answer…yes, you can. Many, many, many have over the generations…and most likely, there are many in your ward who currently do.

[Anonymous]

SilentDawning wrote:

…Perhaps now I’m seeing why he didn’t answer immediately. Perhaps he saw I would have repeated commitment crises and a lot of emotional suffering due to my idealism and expectations of this organization (brought about by its own claims, I might add) as well as the inevitable frailties of the leaders in it. Perhaps he knew that innately, I was a good person and lived all the basic clean life commandments easily WITHOUT the rules and punishments in our Church, and didn’t need them — other avenues would be OK, but I had not yet found them and had rejected them due to my exposure to Mormonism. But after persistence, he gave me the answer I wanted because perhaps, for a period in my life or forever, it would result in some net good, compared to not having it at all.

Thanks for sharing this, SilentDawning.

I believe, as you implied, that spiritual experiences are essentially resonating with God… with what makes us happy, in the big picture.

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…Therefore, I wonder if the answer I received in prayer was suitable at that time. That believing everything literally was useful for a period of my life, but that I have now I have seen the truth about our Church — it is like any other temporal, man-made organization. It is one of many paths to salvation eventually. Perhaps Mormons will have to go through some major deconstruction as God reveals the master plan when this life is over. So will the Baptists, the Pentacostals, and also the Muslims. But given the powerful nature of God, we will all be satisfied with the end result.

Yeah… like there are many ways to reach the top of a mountain.

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Related to this, during the initial phases of my last crisis, I was incredibly moved by Ben Franklin’s statement, which I have quoted a number of times. That men who claim absolute religious truth are like men walking in a fog. They think they see all clearly. But from 300 feet, with vision that cuts through the fog, they are just as much in the fog as other men. All men THINK they see clearly within the range of their own microcosms and believe as staunchly as the rest. Only God sees through the fog, and knows the position of each man, and whether he is walking toward the end goal, as most of them are.

I like that analogy of the fog too… yet I’m also a little “in the fog” about it.

On one hand… hiding from what we think is true, is sometimes the source of pain. And if we “know (learn) the truth – it shall make us free.” As Doug mentioned, “consistence is an illusion that we create.” If we give ourselves & others room to be our dynamic selves, it might give us a sense of freedom & peace.

On the other hand, “Functional illusions are priceless.” They’re what we count on – even live for! If when Michelangelo first picked up a paint-brush, he thought, “I’m no good at this” (although it may have been “true” at that time)… he may have never had the motivation to see what he could become. He had to have faith beyond the blunt present truth.

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To extend the analogy, with men becoming Churches, perhaps He answers searching men who question if they should join other men (Churches). He lets them adopt their limited vision, and be partners with them in the walk toward the end of the field. To some men, he will say “Yes”, join with that man (Church). To others, he will say “No”. To the persistent, who may well abandon any walk toward the destination without guidance, He allows them to join with the closest and best fit for that searcher, even if it’s not the ideal one. He many never find the best partner, given the size of the field and the depth of the fog, but He may reach the destination.

Thank you, thank you – for calling it like it is! “Joining men or other men (& women lol)”. Intellectually, I know that ALL religions are mad-made (lol I meant man-made) creations. Yet, I’ve had it drilled into me so many times, from LDS & general Christians that they are the ONLY way to God & anybody else not following it is condemned to outerdarkness. Ironicly, those who threaten that are themselves in a type of fog-like awareness… as we all are to some degree, as you mentioned…

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Perhaps I am like the man who has realized we are all in the fog, and am seeing the entire field more accurately from 300 feet after years of experience. That this particular Church and its view of absolute truth, is only one of many…

I welcome comments….

I wish I could somehow have reverse binoculars… that allowed me to experience church with the big picture in mind.

So, when somebody makes a comment… I don’t get annoyed, I just think, “Hm… that’s one perspective… & I may have had that one too at one time.”

And to see more clearly the “net good” that comes from people joining together to try to do good (however they interpret it).

[Anonymous]

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I wish I could somehow have reverse binoculars… that allowed me to experience church with the big picture in mind. So, when somebody makes a comment… I don’t get annoyed, I just think, “Hm… that’s one perspective… & I may have had that one too at one time.” And to see more clearly the “net good” that comes from people joining together to try to do good (however they interpret it).

Featherina — I’m glad someone actually read my Epistle! (just kidding, I know I can be long-winded).

I don’t get annoyed as much anymore either. When they come to me for advice, I adopt the lens of Stage 3 and act as their consultant, giving suggestions within their frame of reference — this is because I understand the Stage 3 thinking completely. Like you, I wish I had reverse binoculars and knew the full implications of what I was getting into when I joined the Church at the ripe old year of 20, and out of enthusiasm, paid tithing on the total amount of student loans I had received from the government in my first year of university. Talk about an extreme sense of enthusiasm for the new religion I had found, that answered all my questions!

[Anonymous]

SilentDawning wrote:

Featherina — I’m glad someone actually read my Epistle! (just kidding, I know I can be long-winded).

Hey, that’s nothin’ – I used to write, “novels” to my friends… using all sides of the birthday card. 😆

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I don’t get annoyed as much anymore either. When they come to me for advice, I adopt the lens of Stage 3 and act as their consultant, giving suggestions within their frame of reference — this is because I understand the Stage 3 thinking completely. Like you, I wish I had reverse binoculars and knew the full implications of what I was getting into when I joined the Church at the ripe old year of 20, and out of enthusiasm, paid tithing on the total amount of student loans I had received from the government in my first year of university. Talk about an extreme sense of enthusiasm for the new religion I had found, that answered all my questions!

It seems like whatever you do, you put your heart & soul into it! I think that’s good! Isn’t that what Jesus taught by saying not to be, “luke warm” or else we’ll be spit out?

I try to keep it simple… but I often feel the need to help people see more, not just traditional twisted belief packages.

But with lots & lots of help… I’m learning to hold my tongue & listen. :silent:

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