the wife will be mad if I don’t renew my recommend.

[andersonsrus]

K. I’m here for the first time, but I have to say that I LOVE it.

Nice to know that there are people like me out there.

So my wife and I recently moved to Ireland from Provo. The Church here is much better and I find myself actually wanting to go to church which is a huge change from my days in Happy Valley, where I hated Fridays, because I knew that the weekend was near and the weekend meant church.

Anyway, I’ve been fairly active in the ward over the past few months, but my temple recommend is set to expire soon.

I really don’t want to renew it. The last time I went to the temple I felt awful and I hated every minute of it. I was physically ill in the celestial room because of anxiety (and no there weren’t worthiness issues involved). I looked at everyone in their temple clothes and I said “What on earth am I doing here? Is this what Christ actually taught?”

Anyway, my wife knows about my recent struggles with the faith, but is so happy because my attitude has changed about going to church. but I know she’s going to be upset when I tell her that I don’t want to get a new recommend.

We live in Ireland, so it’s not like we’ll be going to the temple any time soon anyway because the closest temple is in England. I just don’t want to renew it. I have no desire. I know that this is going to crush my wife because she’s thinking that everything is “all better” with me and church now.

Do I just go and get a recommend anyway, knowing that I won’t be going to the temple anyway and avoid the confrontation? Some thoughts from some sensible and like-minded people would be great.

[Anonymous]

Hi and thanks for joining us.

As a child of 8 years, I so looked forward to my baptism. I still remember my own father taking me down into the warm baptismal water and baptizing me in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. I knew that Christ Himself had walked many miles to the river to be baptized by John the Baptist. I knew how pleased His Heavenly Father was with Him when he humbled Himself and was baptized. I later learned that baptism was a symbolic of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. I delighted in the Article of Faith which described the first four principles and ordinances of the gospel, first faith in the Lord, Jesus Christ, Second Repentance, Third Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins and fourth the laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost. I had such a burning testimony as a child, I still do, of those simply, saving ordinances. I always looked forward to each Sunday and renewing my covenants by partaking of the sacrament.

I knew that the gospel of Jesus Christ was true. I felt it all through my soul. I tried to repent every single week and prepare for the sacrament. I felt myself growing spiritually and felt the presence of the Lord in my life . . . . . . then came the temple.

I was called to serve a mission and prepared to take out my endowments in the Salt Lake Temple. Baptism had been so open (Christ was openly baptized in the river for all to see). There was NO secrecy – regardless of how sacred the event (the baptism of Christ), we covenant openly with Christ, I believed. The Temple was secret.

There was NO simplicity, but elaborate complexities. I had understood God in His simplicity, the blessing of children (down openly), baptism etc. – all performed in the open air for all to see. The gospel was nothing to be ashamed of, nothing to hide. I loved and craved that openness, blessing children under the open sky, baptizing in outdoor rivers, blessing the sick – all under the sky for God the Father to see. Now, everything was secret.

I hate to say it, but the initiatory seemed to diminish my baptism. Wasn’t I already initiated into the Kingdom of God? I couldn’t understand going through a veil. Christ taught, “verily, verily, I saw unto you that except a man be born of the water and of the spirit, he can in nowise enter the Kingdom of God”. I thought that my baptism (and keeping my baptismal covenants) WAS my entry into the Kingdom of God. No I was told that I needed more. I felt that I had lost Christ on the day I went to the Temple, but I was young and probably didn’t understand.

I went home and read the scriptures and James E. Talmages, Jesus the Christ. I loved the two chapters which dealt with Christ clearing the Temple. I realized after reading of the second “clearing of the Temple”, that Christ was teaching us how to cleanse our innermost self of unrighteousness, unholiness, greed, ungodliness and prepare our mortal temples (our bodies) to receive the Spirit of Christ. Christ will not enter an unclean temple. He is angry when we defile ourselves. We have to follow His lead and “cleanse our own temples”, through fasting, prayer, repentance and obedience.

Yes, there is a physical House of the Lord. I feel fire when I look at pictures of the Kirtland Temple. But I sorrow so much for what the Temple has become today. Weddings are held in secret rooms – Christ NEVER attended a secret wedding. I wish that we could go back to the days of what Temples used to be at the time of Christ. Christ was just 10 years old when he went to the Temple to be with His Father. The Temple used to be a House of Learning, a House of Prayer, it was literally a place where Christ Himself went to be with His Father and learn how to be a God. A ten year old Christ could not enter the Temple today.

[Anonymous]

andersonsrus, you might want to read another thread about the temple. It has 40 comments, and there is some really good discussion in it. The link is:

“temple stuff” – (http://forum.staylds.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=146)

[Anonymous]

I just read the other thread on the temple. But I’ve got to agree with everything that MWallace said about the temple.

My mom (member of a different faith) still does not understand why family are not allowed at a wedding unless they are active members of the church. That just seems very uninclusive. But right now I am going thru my trial of faith. It is hard to believe that I will think any differently in the future, but you never know.

[Anonymous]

thanks for posting your story.

andersonsrus wrote:

Do I just go and get a recommend anyway, knowing that I won’t be going to the temple anyway and avoid the confrontation?

I guess it depends on how you feel about things. I have not feared confrontation much anymore, but I certainly don’t seek it out unnecessarily. I have not tried to make things a matter of principle where I will not pay any tithing in order show my doubt about church, or try to raise my hand in Gospel Doctrine to point out Christ is not being taught in classes.

I don’t NEED to go out of my way to make things harder for me, as I work through my doubts privately. But there are times when things impact my family and I feel I do need to speak up about things. There is always a cost/benefit analysis on the decisions I make.

All of that is to say, if you don’t have a problem keeping the recommend, even if you don’t plan to use it…I’d say just keep it current…it may make your life easier. Of course, renewing it would require being honest in heart, not just seeking the easiest path, but also not trying to take the roughest path just to be prideful.

[Anonymous]

I guess my advice would be to try to find meaning in the temple that works for you. At the end of the day, each of us must work out our own situation. If you can get to a place where you can find meaning and peace in the temple, it will make more sense for you to keep a current recommend. While caving to marital pressure is also sometimes a really good idea (our spouses do so much for us), if you can’t make it work for you, you’ll only resent it. Is it the having of the TR or the temple attendance your wife wants?

[Anonymous]

andersonsrus I have thought about your issue during the day as it is very close to my own experience. So I think you need to consider a few things

[Anonymous]

It is interesting to hear differing opinions.

I started having doubts about the Church a few years ago during the first year of my marriage and my last two years at BYU. My wife was crushed when I told her I no longer thought the church was true. It was a painful and emotional time for both of us. I stopped going to church regularly, although I had to go because my Bishop was a stickler about attending church to get the ecclesiastical endorsement that allowed me to go to school. So for two years I sat through religion classes and sunday school classes and picked apart everything in them. The issue of leaving the church (which I seriously considered doing after I graduated) fell to the side, and I finally just grew complacent about the church and realized that I will probably stay marginally active for the rest of my life, if only to give my children (I have none as of yet) a good moral and spiritual foundation that served me when I was younger.

I renewed my Temple recommend two years ago, mostly out of habit than out of actually wanting to go, and there was about a year long dry spell where I did not go to the Temple at all, despite living about 3 blocks from the Provo Temple.

I decided to go again because my wife’s father had been dead long enough to have his Temple work done, and she wanted me to stand in proxy for him. I figured that it couldn’t hurt, and might actually do some good for me.

I admit that the baptism and washings did not bother me so much. I actually enjoyed the baptism. But when we went to do the endowments, I was shocked and appalled. I won’t go into detail to avoid offending anyone, but I have to be frank…the temple clothes, the prayer circle, and the ceremony itself really unnerved me. I remember thinking “what happened to faith in Jesus Christ, repentance, baptism, the gift of the HG and enduring to the end?” Toss in the proper Priesthood authority and you have the perfect recipe for exaltation. All of the sudden I realized that the simplicity of the Gospel was tossed out the window.

I told myself that I wasn’t going back, at least for a long time. As I said before, I’ve really enjoyed Church in Ireland. The Saints here are faithful and have very strong testimonies…most are first generation members who have been disowned by their Catholic families. I’ve felt the spirit here for the first time in almost a year, and I have a calling in the ward. My wife couldn’t be happier.

But when I think about going back to the Temple, it makes me queasy. My wife asked me the other day if I planned on getting my recommend renewed (I had expressed my doubts about it shortly after my last temple experience) probably hoping that I would say “Of course, dear! Why wouldn’t I?” What I said was “We’ll see when we get to that point.” Mainly in an effort to buy time. I knew she wasn’t satisfied, but she didn’t pursue it.

Anyway, I think my wife wants everything to be back the way it was before my doubts and loss of faith. She mentioned the desire to travel to England and attend the Temple and how nice it would be for me to be with her. I think in her mind it’s more the principle of the thing. Good members have Temple recommends, and if i get one it will be another step on my road back toward the beaten path.

As I said before, I am enjoying MUCH more now than I have in literally years. I wish I could just separate the Temple from everything else…make it possible to be a good member with faith in Jesus Christ without having to go and participate in “sacred” and secret rituals.

[Anonymous]

Welcome to the forum! This is an interesting thread, and I have a few thoughts. First, a disclosure might be in order. I am LDS, but don’t attend much these days…I go for my kids’ events, but mostly find my spiritual enhancement in the Rocky Mountains by way of a good hike.

You, like many here, seem to be in the middle of your cog-dis stage. There is regret and feelings that the church isn’t what you grew up to believe it was. My suggestion, fwiw, is that it is okay to be feeling that way. It is okay to have some anger, confusion, sadness, and even depression. For goodness sake, you have just had your simple paradigm and purpose of life rug ripped out from under you! Embrace the emotions, and go forward with the challenge to find peace and true spirituality — not the peace that others say you should feel, but what you find is needed in your heartand soul.

The stage where you are concerned about how your wife will feel about your behaviors (wrt church particularly) is indeed a challenging one. Many of us married, and committed our lives to our spouses at a time when we really didn’t know much. It’s unfortunate, but just the way it is. So later, when we learn quite conflicting things from what we previously thought, we experience guilt for our new knowledge. Think about how crazy that is! We negotiate our new understanding with what our family members think is okay; quite stifling, unfortunately.

I think it is ultimately most important that you learn to fly; give yourself the permission to explore outside the box. Learn to live from an internal locus rather than external. Find your truth in your heart, not the outside world and people.

Okay, more specifically, it feels to me like you would benefit from a sit down, heart to heart with your wife. If it were me, I would say something like, “honey, I love you with all heart. You know I have learned some things that have changed my approach to church, and I feel like I need to be authentic with my soul. For the time being, I don’t feel like I would be honest with myself and others to attend the temple. It just doesn’t feel right today. I don’t know how I’ll feel tomorrow, but I need to go with my gut right now. Please know that I support you in your beliefs, and I hope you will be able to support me in mine — whatever that turns out to be.”

I know that may be an issue for her, as the church couples’ paradigm is very codependent. But if she is able to make the transition, and not feel the need to “fix” you, your marriage will be much better.

Good luck, and keep us current!

[Anonymous]

Thank you everyone for your words of encouragement. I love my wife more than anything, and it really hurts me to see her so disappointed in my situation. She is the best thing that has happened to me. A lot of my reasoning to stay in the Church was because of her. The Church is important to her; she’s a convert who still has a very strained relationship with her evangelical mother because she joined. It also served as a anchor to me in my youth, and I think it’s important for children to have a spiritual foundation. I also really hoped that I could find the spirit and happiness that the Church once brought to my life, because I loved it.

I certainly hope that I don’t sound anti-LDS. I have concerns and problems, but I love the idea of the Church. I agree and love 95% of it. It’s just that pesky 5% that seems to be dragging me down.

I once found peace and happiness within its figurative walls. I would like to find that peace again. But every time I get close to feeling that way again, my mind says “what about x?” or “remember y?”

I think there are some wise words of council from all of you.

I think I’ll sit down with her and discuss my concerns. It may be that after a discussion that I will renew my recommend to give her peace of mind, even if I don’t plan on going. Or it may be that she understands my concerns and is willing to grant me some space and time that I think I need. Either way, wish me luck everyone!!

[Anonymous]

How about using the temple only as a place of isolation from the world and reflection – tuning out everything else that is happening, having your body go through the ritual motions and just opening up your mind and heart to God the whole time? Try letting Him teach you what He can teach YOU – and seeing it as your best offering right now.

I’m positive it will be accepted in that spirit if offered thus.

[Anonymous]

andersonsrus wrote:

I certainly hope that I don’t sound anti-LDS. I have concerns and problems, but I love the idea of the Church. I agree and love 95% of it. It’s just that pesky 5% that seems to be dragging me down.

I once found peace and happiness within its figurative walls. I would like to find that peace again. But every time I get close to feeling that way again, my mind says “what about x?” or “remember y?”

You don’t sound “anti” or even antagonistic. We know. We’re right there with you working on the same goals of finding peace an fulfillment.

[Author]

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