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hawkgrrrl wrote:
I know of two people who very successfully pushed back in specific situations, so I’ll share. One is my mother. She was asked if they played with face cards or had them in the home. She said, “We do, but you aren’t allowed to ask that as part of the temple recommend interview.” He said that “technically, I can’t refuse to sign your recommend for that, but I strongly urge you to get rid of them.” She didn’t.My favorite story was my friend’s dad who was being called as a bishop and was being interviewed by the SP. My friend’s dad was a very educated college professor with a beard and colored shirts and strong opinions. The SP asked him if he read his scriptures every day. He said, “You can’t ask me that,” and his SP said he wanted to know. He said, “Fine. I read all 4 standard works on December 31st of every year, all in one day.” I can’t tell you how much I love that story. Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer.
This was not in a TR interview, but it was in an interview for a new SP. I know this guy very well and fully believe the story. It happened several years ago (at least three stake presidencies ago). My friend was a SP counselor and it was time to change SP. Many interviews go on in a short time during that process, and he believes he was being interviewed for the SP position, not just being asked about who should be SP (he had already been asked that). The GA (who I won’t name) asked the question “Have you done anything in your life that if it came to light might bring embarrassment to the church?” to which my friend answered “Yes, hasn’t everybody?” The interview stopped there and my friend was not called as SP (or retained as counselor). Apparently that was not the right answer. FWIW, my friend has been in high profile callings since then so there apparently wasn’t long term damage.
hawkgrrrl wrote:
I know of two people who very successfully pushed back in specific situations…
Ya, I would agree. I would take back what I said that you can’t push back, and more make it just an option (option#1) if you want to take the direct route. Good point.There is a way to have the interview be within your own boundaries you allow church leaders to treat you with. It isn’t always easy (or fun) but you do have ways of doing it properly.
I’m surprised people have gotten away with pushing back. We had a SP who would ask if you do your home teaching before the interview. They attached it to supporting local leaders….I always did mine so I don’t know what that SP member did when people said “no”. I know of one Bishop that took away a TR since the person didn’t do their VT, and he later told me he wasn’t going to do it anymore because she left the interview crying….so, our reactions do influence.
I personally wouldn’t go into an interview in a stake where they ask questions I don’t think I can ask honestly. I chose not to go into my daughter’s wedding in the temple since I wasn’t a full tithe payer at the time. That was the price I paid, so it makes not having a TR under most other circumstances an easy sacrifice.
So glad I’m liberated from feeling I need a TR. Then I wouldn’t have to face situations like this where the Bp or Sp crosses the line.
SilentDawning wrote:
I’m surprised people have gotten away with pushing back.
I think it really depends on a variety of circumstances. Leadership roulette, your “cred” in the ward, your ability to push back in a soft mormonesque and sheepese way that does not make the questioner defensive, Leadership’s ability to take gentle pushback without feeling attacked.
Unfortunately, I believe that those that feel empowered to ask extra questions are also more likely to feel personally challenged by any pushback.
Roy wrote:
…I believe that those that feel empowered to ask extra questions are also more likely to feel personally challenged by any pushback.I agree with your statement. I believe that anything said at this point, that doesn’t directly answer or address the “extra” question would be
perceived as pushback. Is there ever a point in the interview when you would (or should) get up & walk without the recommend? The reason
I ask is once I get to a TR interview, I’ve asked & answered the questions to my own satisfaction. The rest is a formality.
If I can’t answer any of the questions honesty, I won’t take the meeting. If the questions go beyond the guidelines, I hope I have strength to say
I wasn’t prepared for your question. I need to think & pray about it further. The reality is I don’t need a TR to feel whole, complete or spiritual.
I need the TR to do temple work for my ancestors. And in return, I feel connected to people I knew & loved.
Minyan Man wrote:
The reality is I don’t need a TR to feel whole, complete or spiritual.
I think when you have this mindset, it makes the interview less stressful.
You can pushback (may not feel like pushback, but simply stating how you feel) and have less fear about what the interviewer is implying, or asking, or making you feel.
You simply accept them as mortals in a chair doing their job. And there is no magical discernment going on, just a leader trying to fulfill what they think is their stewardship as they’ve been asked to do it.
Those that feel empowered can still answer in kind and loving ways, without making it confrontational. The purpose of the interview can be to reflect, and the end result can be to get the TR while striving to do better and always strive for more…without the mental baggage we sometimes place on ourselves.
Minyan Man wrote:
If I can’t answer any of the questions honesty, I won’t take the meeting.That’s it for me right there. I would straighten up any problems BEFORE I go into the meeting so I can answer the questions honestly. Otherwise, I’d stay away.
If you walk out of a meeting because they asked a question you don’t want to answer that is outside of the normal TR questions, then THAT is an answer in and of itself. The leader may not follow up on it, or he may hound you. I’d avoid that problem by going in honest.
Heber13 wrote:
Minyan Man wrote:
The reality is I don’t need a TR to feel whole, complete or spiritual.
I think when you have this mindset, it makes the interview less stressful.
You can pushback (may not feel like pushback, but simply stating how you feel) and have less fear about what the interviewer is implying, or asking, or making you feel.
You simply accept them as mortals in a chair doing their job. And there is no magical discernment going on, just a leader trying to fulfill what they think is their stewardship as they’ve been asked to do it.
Those that feel empowered can still answer in kind and loving ways, without making it confrontational. The purpose of the interview can be to reflect, and the end result can be to get the TR while striving to do better and always strive for more…without the mental baggage we sometimes place on ourselves.
I’m pretty much in this spot too. I don’t need a TR just to “prove my worthiness” to anyone, including myself. I feel very comfortable answering the questions with my own nuance, and I have always seen them as more reflective in nature and not measures of perfection. I am not one who wants or likes to run to the temple all the time, and in fact find it tedious (never mind the fact I don’t actually believe in work for the dead). Unless there is a family event at the temple I want to go to I really don’t care if I have a TR or not. But this is also one of the things the more orthodox simply cannot seem to comprehend about the less orthodox or heterodox types – that the thing itself (that tiny piece of paper) really doesn’t matter. I actually had the “pleasure” of being in a SM recently where the temple president and matron spoke – she actually (no lie or exaggeration) referred to the recommend as a credit card with God and said it was of greater value than anything else.
“credit card with God” I. Can’t. Stop. Laughing.
I am not making fun of her. I know she was sincere. I know that analogy means a lot to her. But . . .
😆 😆 😆 😆 DarkJedi wrote:I’m pretty much in this spot too. I don’t need a TR just to “prove my worthiness” to anyone, including myself. I feel very comfortable answering the questions with my own nuance, and I have always seen them as more reflective in nature and not measures of perfection.
I really love this sentiment! I’m working towards genuinely feeling “comfortable answering the questions with my own nuance” but I’m not quite there yet.
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