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Cadence wrote:
Say what you need to to get the recommend and be done with it and move on. To often we want to try and explain ourselves in the interview.
I totally agree. I think I worried a little about a few things before my last interview, like about Joseph Smith as a prophet, but during the interview, I could answer “yes” and caught myself wanting to say things like “well, I accept him as this kind of prophet or that way, but not as I sometimes hear taught in church…” when really, those qualifications aren’t necessary. As long as I believe it enough to answer “yes” honestly in middle-way fashion…I’m good to go.
Heber13 wrote:Sounds rough, Sambee. Sorry to hear it … especially when you put so much preparation into it.
As you thought about it, what was the thing that upset you the most?
1 Was it his comments about your personality?
2 Was it that he doesn’t understand you?
3 Was it that he didn’t complete the interview and you didn’t get a TR?
Just wondering, since I want to support you and understand the situation.
Thanks for your kind words (and that goes for everyone else on here).
I’ve numbered your questions.
! & 2, I see them as facets of the same problem. We’re not all happy smiley folk. I can be as happy as Larry, but still get folk telling me to cheer up. I grew up a single child in the country. I didn’t have to be loud and demonstrative. I don’t like being in large groups of people I don’t know – that means I hate cocktail parties (or whatever the LDS equivalent is), office workshops, but don’t mind football matches, the cinema etc.
3 – Yes, this bothers me, but less than the other two. My original notion is at two questions a fortnight, it’s going to take me six months to get through this. (Am I being cynical or is this so that it can be held off til next but one stake conference?) In retrospect, some of the questions don’t apply to me at all. I don’t abuse my wife/family, since I don’t have one to abuse… not a question of whether or not I do so, it’s just not an issue. (Not that I would if I did!) If I’ve sired any children anywhere, that will be news to me, no one’s ever told me about it.
Quote:Devil’s Advocate: He acted like my personality was completely wrong as if I was a no good lazy slacker and problem child in addition to being too shy.
In some cases it is possible to bring someone out of their shell and make them develop, but some of this is programming. I have had people making complaints of this nature about me since I was in Kindergarten.
I used to play team sport years ago, and one of the things I noticed is how certain positions/players got all the glory, whereas others did the work that set it up. That’s how it is in life, probably the church too. For every poster boy/girl who shines off the pulpit and is admired by all the women, and says the right thing in prayers and testimonies, there’s a dumpy plain person cleaning the meeting house, preparing the flowers, playing the music etc and doing all the donkey work.
cwald wrote:Yeah, one would think a bishop would react different to a guy who was excited and truly working to make it to the temple for the first time.
Perhaps my only advise, which you have heard a thousand times i’m sure, is just answer Yes, or No. I don’t think you’re obligated to give information, and the Bishop is obligated to stick to the questions. Leave the cat in the bag, and just answer the questions as you understand them. Be vague.
Good luck Sambee.
Thanks, Cwald.
The TR interview had a massive pre-amble, with two questions added. 2/3->3/4 was general conversation, then the two questions about God and then the one about the atonement. He did stretch out these two questions and asked me to explain stuff. I do believe in the atonement, and Holy Ghost, but for me to explain these concepts in words is pretty difficult.
This is maybe where we get things wrong. In Buddhism and Hinduism, there is a notion of “transmission”, which is where an idea can be given to another person through an object lesson, messages within words etc, but not actually by words. I suppose you could call it “intuitive” (I notice New Agers have hijacked this word recently but that’s not what I mean.) To me, the idea of the atonement, Holy Ghost etc, can only be transmitted through direct experience, or indirectly through other means, it’s not something that can be put in a couple of paragraphs in Gospel Principles.
I have worked hard on this, and it kills me. I don’t know what I’ll do on Sunday. The irony is that when I joined, I said I didn’t want to go on a mission (I had my reasons, such as shyness and also the practicalities of who would look after my house and belongings), and they were trying to force me. Seems like if you’re 18-20 something, they’ll pin you down and shove you on your mission, but if you’re older it’s almost like they don’t want to know. Why put me through two sets of preparation classes for something I’m not ready for?
Quote:Ray – If you’ve been to the temple fairly recently, you don’t have to have a temple recommend interview with the Bishop. Obviously, you probably shouldn’t ask explicitly for a counselor, but there is NO reason for a recommend holder to have to wait for a full recommend interview. I simply would ask for an actual recommend interview, answer the questions with yes or no and walk out with a recommend – hopefully.
My temporary TR dates from October, so should be more or less expired.
I don’t know how I’m going to ask him for a plain recommend, but I’m going to have to tell him in no uncertain terms that I didn’t find his manner helpful, and my personality issues are not something I can help. I’ve got to work out how to do this without being combative. If I can express it that I find these things to be disabilities, he may get it. I may even have to use the “A” word about the social issue – I’ve never been diagnosed as being on the spectrum, but he might have to hear it from me.
Quote:Doug – From one shy person to another, I’m very sorry to hear about your experience. There was no need for any of that. It sounds like your bishop has issues. Assuming that you want to continue with the process, I wonder if it would be possible for you to prepare yourself for the remaining interview(s) so that you have the upper hand, at least from your perspective.
I don’t know what to do about preparation. I thought I was prepared, and made the effort. He kept on asking me why I was staring down at the tissues – I hadn’t started the interview that way.
There are other aspects of this I was very uncomfortable with. I felt opening myself up like this made me incredibly vulnerable, and I’m a grown man. Where I come from – and folk can call this macho if they want – men suffer in private, and don’t allow someone to make them suffer like that.
SamBee wrote:
Quote:Doug – From one shy person to another, I’m very sorry to hear about your experience. There was no need for any of that. It sounds like your bishop has issues. Assuming that you want to continue with the process, I wonder if it would be possible for you to prepare yourself for the remaining interview(s) so that you have the upper hand, at least from your perspective.
I don’t know what to do about preparation. I thought I was prepared, and made the effort. He kept on asking me why I was staring down at the tissues – I hadn’t started the interview that way.
Well, you kind of already said what I had in mind …
Quote:I’m going to have to tell him in no uncertain terms that I didn’t find his manner helpful, and my personality issues are not something I can help. I’ve got to work out how to do this without being combative.
That, and thinking about how to tactfully drag the discussion back to “yes” and “no”. And as you know, “whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.”
It doesn’t exactly help, but a neighbor keeps on blocking my drive with his taxi, and I had to have a word with him today after leaving three notices on his car. Someone has painted a “keep clear” sign on the road, so I’m not the only one. I am also having to organise a meeting today which no one is likely to turn up to, for a society which is having its fiftieth anniversary this year. People keep on complaining I’m doing nothing but I am unable to look at the society’s finances and they’re not turning up, so my hands are tied.
This is probably of no interest to anyone here, but it means I am under stress outside the church.
Quote:This is probably of no interest to anyone here.
Of course it is. It adds to the overall picture – and stress is stress, regardless of its source.
Hang in there. Pretend you’re in labor and practice Lamaze breathing.
Yeah, guess what nobody did turn up to that meeting. I waited around half an hour and just left… Trying hard NOT to go to war with my neighbor, and praying about it.
SamBee wrote:1 & 2, I see them as facets of the same problem. We’re not all happy smiley folk. I can be as happy as Larry, but still get folk telling me to cheer up. I grew up a single child in the country. I didn’t have to be loud and demonstrative. I don’t like being in large groups of people I don’t know – that means I hate cocktail parties (or whatever the LDS equivalent is), office workshops, but don’t mind football matches, the cinema etc.
3 – Yes, this bothers me, but less than the other two. My original notion is at two questions a fortnight, it’s going to take me six months to get through this. (Am I being cynical or is this so that it can be held off til next but one stake conference?) In retrospect, some of the questions don’t apply to me at all. I don’t abuse my wife/family, since I don’t have one to abuse… not a question of whether or not I do so, it’s just not an issue. (Not that I would if I did!) If I’ve sired any children anywhere, that will be news to me, no one’s ever told me about it.
What if you send a letter or email to the bishop, short and sweet, and just state that it will take 6 months or too long at this pace. If you feel worthy, is there some reason the bishop is hesitating, because it is causing you stress.How do you think he’d respond?
I like Heber13’s suggestion and would add something about why it is causing you stress (due to your personality, which he alluded to, and your shyness or discomfort with confrontational conversations, lest he think you are stressed because you’re not really worthy). Hi Sambee, I wouldn’t take your visit with the new bishop too seriously. To take that long to go through a temple recommend interview seems excessive by this new bishop. I have never had a bishop take this long to go through a TR interview. Maybe he is being overly cautious being he is new to the calling and taking it ultra-seriously. Remember he is just as human as you and I and prone to make human errors like any one of us. Him commenting on your personality, not sure why he did that but maybe he may believe you aren’t worthy. His perception is just that and doesn’t necessarily mean he is correct in his perception. My mother had a temple recommend interview with a bishop once and asked her if she had ever engaged in a lesbian relationship lol ! And believe me… she never has and she definitely doesn’t have a “butchiness” aura about her lol.
I hope this helps.
BLC
I lost a post I made on this…. but briefly… I pulled him aside on Sunday and spoke to him, told him how I felt. He was very apologetic. I will meet with him again.
I’ll post something longer on this like the one I lost… when I feel like it again!
Not much to add to the great comments that have been made so far but to say that I really feel for you. Ugh, this is a bad case of “Priesthood Leader Roulette”. I hope that your subsequent actions are more positive. I agree there is NO reason you should not be able to finish a temple recommend in one sitting. Perhaps you won’t get one, perhaps you need follow up (not saying you do; I can just imagine those being possibilities) but to spread out the interview seems ridiculous.
The bishop is there to ask you questions. YOU are the one who has to feel worthy, not him (I realize he is a “judge in Israel” but I still think we are the ones who determine our worthiness).
I’ve since had another interview, and it went pretty well. I apologized for my own attitude, and said we’d got off on the wrong foot. He even gave me some insurance advice for free! Good to hear – and instructive, as well. Thanks for letting us know! Good to hear.
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