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Up until about 2 days ago I thought I could go through this journey and stay in the church. Now I am feeling propeled beyond it. I feel like I am unlocking (unsealing) the true meaning of the scriptures and that when I’m done the purpose of the church will be fulfilled. Crap. I’m kinda scared. I’ve been a TBM my whole life. I’m in the RS presidency right now. Almost 100% of my friends and family are TBM.
The only person who knows about my changes is my husband. I really don’t know what to do. I’ve been debating about asking for a release….help.
First question: When you say “beyond it” what do you mean? (to some other organization or to a higher consciousness where specific organizational allegiance isn’t necessary?)
If the first, go with God. I mean that sincerely. If the second, make sure you aren’t trading something on the social level for nothing. I believe strongly that spiritual progression must be pursued independently (outside of church), but I also believe just as strongly that it shouldn’t be pursued only outside of church – that organized religion should not be abandoned in the pursuit of personal growth. That whole paradox of seeking and losing is important to me.
Thanks Ray. It’s #2. So, what is the most appropriate way to participate? Basically, I believe the church holds the preparatory gospel that Christ fulfills and takes us to the next level (spiritual rebirth). I guess I’m unsure of what my role should be given my new understanding.
Just me, Tom wrote some profound words to me when i just joined this forum as I was in that “crap – what do I do now?” phase, and he admonished me to go slowly, think slowly, act slowly. I pass his good advice on to you as well.
Remember, we have had a particular paradigm for several long years, and new light and knowledge doesn’t require 180 degree turn and extreme decisions or extreme speech to others that they too must do something now that you’ve found this.
Not knowing what your role is or how to handle it is to me the scary part. I want to know. I want someone to tell me. I want to read the book that straightens it all out. But there is no book like that. There are just several books with bits and pieces of the perspectives we have to learn to grow to a new level of thinking.
Albert Einstein said, “The significant problems we face in life cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.”
Whether we created the need for our new journey or it was created for us is irrelevant. We are now faced with, “what do I do about this?” and the journey to get comfortable moving forward will be fulfilling and meaningful and personal because it is unique to you. It requires a new level of thinking, but there is some comfort in knowing so many others also go through that transition. We’re not alone or unique in that regard. Others figure it out and can stay in the church honestly, and so can you.
Take Tom’s advice. Go slowly. Embrace the idea it is now different, and you will grow from moving forward without panicking and drastically cutting off relationships w/others. Be open minded and seek what feels right to you happy and less burdened.
Those are the things I’m trying to do and how I approach this scary time of being out of my TBM comfort zone.
I agree with Ray’s advice. There is a kite analogy that is sometimes used to illustrate the need for obedience (apparently everything can be used as an analogy for obedience!), but I think the analogy can be used here differently to better effect. The church is like a kite factory, making a specific type of kite. The church doesn’t fly the kites, just make them. As a kite, once you figure out how to fly, I agree with Ray that you’ll fly better if you have an organizational tie. Things that can “ground” your kite: – having a calling
– the friendship of other members
– the routines & rites of the church
– family traditions associated with the church
– teachings, talks, scriptures and discussions that provide you a canvas to respond to and examine your own feelings and thoughts
But when you are flying (pursuing your own personal growth and spirituality), if you look down, all you really see is a community of smiling well-wishers and supporters (the church). And that’s a good thing. But you might occasionally feel sad about the kites that live their whole life in the box, never flying. There also might be a few who want you to fly differently or lower or whatever, but if you are flying high, their voices are pretty faint.
Thanks for talkin’ me down. I guess that really is the hardest part-I’m used to following a script and now I’m on my own. just me wrote:I’m used to following a script and now I’m on my own.
Sounds like an opportunity for growth. But don’t feel like you are too much on your own. We are all on our own…together (what???) – at that to the list of paradoxes.
@just me I have some thoughts on this issue. I don’t know if you’ve already made up your mind but let me give you my thoughts anyway.
I wouldn’t discourage you at all from leaving the church if that’s what you feel is best. I believed, and still do believe that there are other organizations out there just as capable of producing great people, helping us along our spiritual journey, and otherwise helping us socialy to raise our kids, and lead happy lives.
Heber13 said it well though when he said “go slow.” I was very anxious at one point to leave as well, and I thought I could simply never belong to the organization anymore which I felt betrayed me, led me down a narrow-minded orthodox path where I was closed-minded to new ideas, etc. etc.
BUT, and this is a big BUT, in the past 3 weeks I have had renewed faith and patience. This is
notto say that my views on the church have changed per se, but I have recognized a few important things about the church. I still believe service is an important part of our spiritual growth, and for me the church can help me in that. I believe I will be a better individual as a heretic living in an orthodox community. The church provides a good place for this. Now, if I think back to myself 3 weeks ago, I would have just labelled everything I said to you as a lame excuse to stay LDS. Let me reiterate, I am not apologizing, or excusing. For me, I have found that the LDS church is
an optionfor helping me grow spiritually. I do not pretend that it will work for everyone, or that it is even the onlyoption for me or anyone else. In fact, I have really learned to love Zen meditation from Buddhism. Works great for me. Feel free to explore, utilize, and attend other organizations. Ultimately, I agree with Ray that we must pursue our own spirituality outside of
anyorganization. I would encourage you to use any organization you belong to as a tool, a utility for your benefit. If you are not getting any benefit, then don’t waste your time. Make sure that you are confident that you cannot get any benefit from the LDS church before you leave (if that’s what’s interesting to you). Keep us updated, and most importantly know that we on this forum (at least I) will be here as a support for you whether you choose to remain LDS or not.
Thanks everyone. I am at a point where I seem to change from day to day. It is so strange. Up to now I have always felt edified and even feel the spirit teach me while at church.
My main worries are 2 things.
1. I am in a leadership position and teach R.S. a few times a year and I’m in charge of Enrichment.
2. I no longer need the symbolism of the temple or the garment. Church tends to be very temple centric. And I’m not sure if it is appropriate for me to be a leader if I am not participating in this aspect of the church.
Your second question is totally up to your bishop. I wouldn’t push it, if I were you. He knows if you have a current temple recommend, and if he is fine with you staying in your calling, I would just do the best you can. More often than not, we are our own worst critics.
Also, just to consider, there is great power in doing some things for a community that you don’t “need” to do personally.
The only thing I would add in relation to your calling is that you ought to feel free to ask to be released if you’re not comfortable with it right now. In a month or two (or year or two) or whenever you are comfortable you can tell your bishop you’re ready for one if he wants. I feel very similar with the temple and garments at this point. But I am continuing in the normal tradition (mostly for my wife’s sake at this point). But I am open to the possibility of embracing garment-wearing in a more spiritually metaphorical context in the future.
Yeah, I am going slow with the no-garment thing for the sake of hubby and the kids. I guess for myself, too. I really don’t want others to notice (somehow?) and ask questions. It’s not like I plan on dressing differently (exept at night 
So much of this is taking place in my head and heart that it feels surreal. Like maybe I’m just imagining myself changing. Okay, maybe that makes no sense. I mean, I have no desire to “break the WoW” or wearing sleevless shirts. It’s so funny because I think I understand why the Children of Isreal always need these outward laws and ordinances! It’s because the mighty change of heart-the spiritual rebirth was/is beyond their under understanding. They need to SEE things with their physical eyes and be able to measure and quantify—-and judge. Yikes! And the whole purpose of the law is to frustrate and humble so that we will turn to Christ.
just me, fwiw, when you are able to internalize and personalize something it becomes MUCH easier to use it (whatever it is) as a personal symbol that holds great power – to imbue it with your own symbolism. For example, I have no illusions whatsoever about the garment being “magical” in some way. However, I absolutely love the concepts of:
1) Being reminded constantly of the covenants I have made – the basic ones of the temple that I think are important and powerful. When I am wearing it, I hardly think about it. It is subconscious in practical terms. However, when I put them on and take them off, I am reminded tangibly of what I am striving to become. That’s important to me, so I wear them as a token of my own personal commitment to God – not as some kind of requirement.
2) Being clothed in the Priesthood power of God – and that concept applies to ALL men AND women who have been endowed. Women who are endowed carry with them actual symbols of godly power, and I personally think that is important in the Church – that women literally have the symbols of the Priesthood in a tangible form even though they can’t exercise that in the administration of ordinances. To me, there is great power in that symbolism – even more so for women than for men in our current society.
3) Progressing toward godliness and entering into the presence of God. That is the symbolic center of the temple for me – that I have the right to approach God and be in God’s presence. Even if I didn’t find other deep meaning in the temple, I would continue to attend simply to participate in that specific symbolism.
I’m not saying everyone should see these things as I do – not at all. However, I caution people to not throw out the available symbols and their potential power when those things can be used for tremendous enlightenment if only adapted slightly for each individual. I wouldn’t think seriously about not wearing garments right now, because I’ve created a way for them to help me personally. Even if someone else thinks “they’re just underwear”, to me they aren’t “underwear” at all. They are a sacred symbol, and that is important to me.
BTW, I personally am not opposed at all to the idea of wearing garments OVER regular underwear – even though I know that is not the Church’s standard. I think that would remove much of the “weirdness” for many people – as they then would be seen as “clothing” without the automatic, negative association with “underwear”.
Good thoughts Ray. I hope that I can one day view the garments more in that light. I’m working on it. In the meantime, while I recognize the symbolism, it seems like just one more thing I “have to do” to remind myself of the symbolism. Sometimes it just feels to me like Mormon rituals are invading my life. Are these rituals really helping me become more spiritual? Or am I doing them because I’m supposed to? Are there not other meaningful, but less invasive (and inconvenient) ways to have personal reminders? Not that I’m dying to wear anything different or anything. I mean some wear a ring, others wear a hat, etc. I agree. I have worn them longer than not worn them in my lifespan now. It feels weird to not wear them. I need to get better at going back to Ray’s standard and remember the symbolism and let that benefit me.
But like just me, I don’t specifically NOT want to wear them anymore than I specifically want to go out and have a coffee, regardless of the commandments or covenants, I don’t think I have to rebel and specifically go out of my way to be NON-MORMON.
It is wrong for others to judge me whether I’m wearing them or not, and equally wrong for me to rebel and try to show everyone I won’t wear them anymore and see if I can shock them. Wear them or not wear them, my focus is on what is my faith in God and what do I need to do to please Him.
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