Utah

[Anonymous]

I moved to Utah a month ago. It’s been a decade since I’ve lived here. I’ve enjoyed several things about being in Utah but it seems every few days I get completely overwhelmed by the overbearing Mormon culture. What makes it even more difficult is I moved from a foreign country that is extremely tolerant and a total 180 from the Utah way of thinking. Maybe one day I’ll have some time to share some of my thoughts on my experiences there.

I don’t want this to turn into a rant about Utah, if you’ve lived here you can probably guess what my frustrations are and what I love about Utah. My issue is I’ve moved a lot and this is by far the worst move I have ever done. What should be the easiest move ever, I mean gosh I’m from here, has been the hardest. I even had one night I was up with anxiety until 2 AM thinking about how to fit in and how to play all the uncomfortable situations that are coming up in the near future with a massive extended family by marriage, all my hard core high school Mormon friends, and a new neighborhood that is 60% Mormon.

The Bishop and a counselor stopped by without calling first about five days after we moved in. They were really nice but I’m a little stressed about their blunt assumptions that we are active. They also went on and on about the family that lived in the house before us as if they expect us to take over as replacements. They even told me I looked just like the woman, not a dead ringer but close. (?!)

The Bishop straight up asked us what callings we had held. My husband was totally unprepared for this question as he is not active due to personality and work and felt embarrassed. I was uncomfortable because I didn’t feel like I knew what to say when I have no intention of taking on a calling but as I rattled off my previous callings they would be assuming I would. Making food for sick people or shoveling walks for old people I’m game for. I guess I need to get into the church building and have a one to one with the Bishop letting him know we aren’t anti, inactive, or TBM Mormons and we don’t want callings. However, whatever our family does participate in we will pull our weight.

So I’m here to ask for advice. On how to deal with this place in the World where similarity of everything including underwear is the key to belonging, because it’s hard right now. Thanks

[Anonymous]

I don’t know that I can offer any good advice, but my first thought is to first demonstrate similarities before revealing all your differences. After people decide they like you they can handle the things they will disagree with if they get it in small doses, with time to assimilate each one before the other comes in. I would also try to remind them of the similarities between doses so they can remember why they are comfortable with you.

I have not always been successful with this but those are my thoughts.

[Anonymous]

I haven’t lived in Utah for a long time but we visit several times a year. One thing that surprises me is how lax many members are. Most of my TR holding family members miss a lot of church and when we are in town they don’t have any problem going out to dinner on Sundays. It seems like most members have pretty easy jobs at church like teaching once a month or playing the piano every other week in RS. Half the members there are less active if not more so if you aren’t there every meeting it will not be anything new. Good luck and don’t stress too much.

[Anonymous]

I’ve lived in Utah my entire life. Now that I’m transitioning out of the church, I totally over analyze every interaction I have with neighbors, family and friends who are TBM. I worry about them realizing I’m not wearing garments or asking me why I’m missing so much church lately. Overall though, these worries have been completely unnecessary. There are things about Utah now that bother me a lot that didn’t before. I can see how it would be very hard to move back here after living in another, more liberal and accepting place. Just continue to be yourself.

Orson wrote:

my first thought is to first demonstrate similarities before revealing all your differences.

I think this is a great idea. There’s no need to broadcast your inactivity in the church. Yes, be honest if someone asks, but I wouldn’t bring it up. Just focus on meeting the neighbors and being friendly. I think you’ll find that people aren’t always as judgmental as we make them out to be in our minds.

I’m sorry your visit from the bishop was unpleasant. Just try to remember that he’s doing the best he can. Maybe take things one day at a time. There are a lot of good things about living in Utah. Good luck!

[Anonymous]

Goldilocks wrote:

The Bishop straight up asked us what callings we had held. My husband was totally unprepared for this question as he is not active due to personality and work and felt embarrassed. I was uncomfortable because I didn’t feel like I knew what to say when I have no intention of taking on a calling but as I rattled off my previous callings they would be assuming I would.

When I was a young boy the entire bishopric came to our home dressed in their Sunday best. During the small talk they made reference to the piano sitting in our living room and asked conversationally if my mom played. My mom didn’t play. After 15 min more of small talk they excused themselves and left. After the door closed I looked at my mom with a puzzled look on my face and asked why they came over. She laughed and said that they must have wanted to call her as the ward pianist but didn’t know that she couldn’t play.

Goldilocks wrote:

My issue is I’ve moved a lot and this is by far the worst move I have ever done. What should be the easiest move ever, I mean gosh I’m from here, has been the hardest. I even had one night I was up with anxiety until 2 AM thinking about how to fit in and how to play all the uncomfortable situations that are coming up in the near future with a massive extended family by marriage, all my hard core high school Mormon friends, and a new neighborhood that is 60% Mormon.

I totally understand this. By all accounts I should fit in just fine. I have all the external markers of a lifelong faithful member of the church. I think that part of this is that some elements of the church have become a foil to my current preferences. Take the church rules for example. I don’t really oppose rules per se but I am so very tired of hearing about them to the exclusion of other approaches. Part of me thinks that I could leave the LDS church and not miss a thing as I feel I have already internalized everything the church has to teach me….Except for that tricky endure to the end part. 😈

I aslo really support the advice Orson gave. :thumbup:

[Anonymous]

60% Mormon? That means at least half are not regular attenders/Mormons! At least 10% will be inactive/less active guaranteed, and 40% is actually a lot!

[Anonymous]

I’m afraid I don’t have any good advice for you other than what’s already been said and what you suggested yourself — set firm boundaries with the bishopric! Let them know you you’re not interested in callings right now, and that in the future you’d appreciate a heads-up phone call before they stop by (as an aside, I can’t believe how common this is in the Church – where are people’s manners?!?).

The angst you’ve descrived is why I’ll never move back to Utah. I’m a Davis County boy, born and raised. I go back occassionally, and I love it for the first few days. I love the mountains, the seasons, the cost of living, the relively cheap land and housing, the recreational opportunities, and all my friends and family. After about Day Three, though, little things start bugging me, and by the end of the week I can’t wait to get the h@ll out of there. I’ll enjoy going back for the rest of my life, but I’ll never live there again. The Church is just so much better in areas where it’s a tiny minority, in my experience.

[Anonymous]

Hi, Goldilocks – I don’t have great advice, but sometimes I’ve wondered if being non-mainstream would actually be easier in Utah. If there isn’t someone like-minded on your block, or in your ward, there’s probably someone the next block and ward over? Sometimes the fewer the number, the more exacting the expectations at church, and the more influence one bishop or one stake president or one blow-hard has over the whole group. At least that’s my theory. Good luck and enjoy what you enjoy.

[Anonymous]

Quote:

my first thought is to first demonstrate similarities before revealing all your differences. After people decide they like you they can handle the things they will disagree with if they get it in small doses, with time to assimilate each one before the other comes in. I would also try to remind them of the similarities between doses so they can remember why they are comfortable with you.

This is great advice. It’s just so hard to remember when I’m dwelling on all the things that are different about me now and being negative. Reading this post helped me realize that I need to accept myself right now if this is going to work out for me to attend the LDS church in any way, shape or form. I won’t be able to play up my similarities if I’m unsure of myself.

Like many LDS women I suffer from a bad case of perfectionism. I wasn’t completely perfect this year, long story short, and don’t feel like I’m good enough to be there. And I hate that kind of thinking, because I know I have a lot of good qualities and outside the church people would consider me a great person. Add on top of that years of a shelf getting heavy and it seems like the time to leave could be soon.

Today is Sunday. What should I do if they ask me and the husband to speak in church and to introduce ourselves? Is there any rules about who can speak in Sacrament? I’m also curious about praying or making comments in classes as a “heathen”. I want to respect the organizational directives.

Another thing I want to do is start attending some other churches as a visitor. Any experiences, advice, or suggestions on doing so? Even if I turned into a full believing practicing member again, I want myself and my kids to understand other religions better.

Thanks to everybody for taking the time to offer your insight. I’ll update you guys after church today if anything interesting happens.

[Anonymous]

I live in a Utah and it is difficult here. It’s like you are given 2 options: all in or all out.

If the Bishop asks you to speak in Church, just say NO! Go to church when you want, don’t go when you don’t want. They’ll figure it out eventually.

There are lots of other churches in Utah. Just be careful revealing you are Mormon. A lot of them get really excited that someone has left the Church and really ask for you to speak out against the church and bring as many former members with you as you can.

You will find friends with similar feelings about the church here, lots of members who only go a few times a year, and even some TBM’s that will accept you where you are at without giving you a hard time.

Get used to the Bishop showing up unannounced. It’s the way it’s done here. Drives me nuts. You can ask him not to, but bear in mind, they do think it’s friendly and neighborly to do so.

Welcome to Zion. 😆

[Anonymous]

When you can walk the boundaries of your ward in minutes (like a former ward my wife attended that is about sixteen square blocks), it’s easy to drop by without a whole lot of advance planning. It’s not good, and it’s not right, but it happens because it’s so easy. I guarantee if they had to drive 20 minutes to see you, they would schedule it in advance.

[Anonymous]

roobytoos wrote:

Get used to the Bishop showing up unannounced. It’s the way it’s done here. Drives me nuts. You can ask him not to, but bear in mind, they do think it’s friendly and neighborly to do so.

There is something to be said for being so close knit that scheduling a drop by isn’t necessary. I know that as a youth I’ve had friends that accepted me into their family to the point that I could come in without knocking and help myself to any leftovers still on the table. I am not advocating that the bishop do this (can you imagine ) but I do have fond memories of being so familiar. Sometimes, we as Mormons do tactless things precisely because of how comfortable we are around each other. We might assume that other Mormons are generally the same as we are – even when they are not – to the point where we let our interpersonal guard down and forgo with more formal pleasantries.

[Anonymous]

Roy wrote:

There is something to be said for being so close knit that scheduling a drop by isn’t necessary. […] Sometimes, we as Mormons do tactless things precisely because of how comfortable we are around each other.

In nearly every instance that the bishop (or bishopric) drops by unannounced, it’s to ask for something or find out information. Rarely to just be social. If that were the case, I wouldn’t mind…but it bothers me. To the extent that when I was in the bishopric, I always called ahead and always told the member what the purpose of the visit was (extend a calling to you, etc.) Next time the bishopric or SP comes by, I’m telling them “Sorry, I’m busy. You should call ahead because, in my opinion, it’s disrespectful to just drop in.”

When we did rescue visits, I refused if the secretary or someone else hadn’t made an appointment. Shocked the bishop a little when I told him I wasn’t going, but he already knew how I felt about just surprising members.

This is one of those practices that chaps my hide :crazy:

[Anonymous]

Many of our cultural traditions formalized in a time of general agricultural dependence, in a societal structure very different than our current model – and this is one such case. Dropping by just to talk or even to conduct some kind of business was an integral part of society then, and it still happens outside of church-related stuff all over the world – especially in rural areas. Our busy lives, including not being home nearly as much as people used to be, has made scheduling visits much more important than it used to be – but it’s hard for some people, in some situations (especially, again, when visiting means walking 5 minutes or less), to understand the need for such a change.

I have turned away unannounced visitors at the door, and my wife working nights right now makes it imperative that people schedule in advance. Do it once, and most people get the message; do it twice, and only the most thick-headed will continue.

[Anonymous]

Goldilocks wrote:

Another thing I want to do is start attending some other churches as a visitor. Any experiences, advice, or suggestions on doing so? Even if I turned into a full believing practicing member again, I want myself and my kids to understand other religions better.

I participate in a number of different churches. We went to a scripture study series with the 7th day Adventists. We go to “Kid’s town” on Sunday night with the Pentecostals. I teach a “Pioneer Club” class for the First Christian Church on Thursdays. We also do Vacation Bible Schools during the summer months.

I was questioned by my bishop about our attendance at other churches. I told him that I draw a distinction between participation and attendance. To put it in generic Christian language, the LDS church is our “home church.”

Just the other day DW was saying that we would fit in well socially with the SDA (7th day Adventists) as she has many friends there and always feels really welcome at their meetings. But then on Sunday night I took the kids to “Kids Town” with the Pentecostals. I was greeting all the great people there and I couldn’t imagine not seeing them anymore. To me the prospect of committing to one religion to the exclusion of all others would be like picking a favorite sibling and not talking to the others. We are a community and I love my community. For a time it felt like we didn’t truly belong anywhere – but now I am feeling like we truly belong in multiple venues.

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