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I love talks that have a personal element. The ward appears to agree as when personal stories are shared, the room quiets down, children are shushed, and posture in the pews improves. These last few years, I am seeing a trend that bothers me. It has become my Pet Peeve.
Our High Councilmen and Stake Presidency have all gotten into the habit of dropping social status cues when they talk.
“When my family was on vacation in Bora Bora ..”
“My wife works in film, and a couple months ago, we had to meet with Brad Pitt, this led my wife and I into a discussion about marriage and fidelity”.
“We were so worried about our 16 year old son. We bought him a new BMW for his birthday, and we became concerned about the possibility of poor decisions if he was influenced by his less righteous friends”
“I reached into my Marc Jacobs purse — you know the black one that I bought off the runway in Milan last Spring — and I pulled out my new Michael Kors wallet, and I realized I had left the Platinum AMEX at home, and I had no cash. And I didn’t know what to do”
All those stories could be shared without the socio-economic markers.
“While we were on vacation ..”
“My wife’s job and some of the people she comes across, got us talking about marriage …”
“Our 16 year old son has started driving .. And we have concerns ..”
“I reached into my purse and realized that I had left my wallet at home..”
Year ago, we lived in a ward that covered many miles. I could drive an hour and still be in the ward. We had a vary diverse ward that included sanitation workers, students, illegal aliens, and prosperous professionals. The more prosperous families went to great efforts to have church not be about status markers. It was kinda fun to watch the various ward members work on finding common ground. They found it through faith, love, and kindness.
Fast forward to now. Our entire stake area is fairly prosperous. Our ward fits that profile. But that doesn’t mean each individual and family is doing well. Every time we have someone stand up to talk, and gratuitious details are added to assure us of their personal prosperity, it makes me wince.
Is this a local phenomenon? Is this a church-wide trend?
I can’t say that happens here. I think our area is more like the prior one you described, a good mix of upper middle class professionals, some people who are dirt poor, and lots in between. I don’t want it to sound wrong, but I hope it’s local to your stake. amateurparent said: Quote:Is this a local phenomenon? Is this a church-wide trend?
There are not many people in my ward who run into Brad Pitt. But the attitude you describe is there. The details may change.
This is especially true when it comes to our family history. I have a tendency to brag about famous relatives & ignore the infamous.
When I do that, one of my friends always reminds me that he is related to Adam & Eve.
Our area is not affluent and we do not seem to have this particular problem. Our bishop is a good man that happens to be CFO/acting CEO of a local company (The CEO is on a leave of absence as they serve as an MP). Our bishop goes to Hawaii for vacation every year and sends all the primary children post cards. I am sure their intentions are good but it has been 3 years of receiving post cards for each primary aged child in our family…we get it… you are in Hawaii…enough already.
😈 amateurparent wrote:Is this a local phenomenon? Is this a church-wide trend?
I think it’s a worldwide thing, meaning that’s just what some people do, church or no church. I don’t see it any more or any less among stake leaders or even among us regular church schmos but I do hear it in our meetings, particularly fast and testimony meetings. It’s a part of the background radiation of life.
amateurparent wrote:“While we were on vacation ..”
For the record… the sanitized version you use here can
stillbe viewed as a social status cue. 
I would write more but my butler is trying to get my attention.
I have never noticed our ward saying things like that either. It may just be certain areas. The ward I’m in now is very low key and most people where I live appear to be middle class to lower class so everyone is pretty laid back and i’ve never had anyone show off expensive things to me here, or heard about them in sacrament. I see it as a local phenomenon. I have been in diverse prosperous areas and the people there have made a conscious effort to include everyone. I am not wealthy, but comfortable (for now), and I felt right at home among the obviously wealthy people who I saw write $100,000 tithing checks. How does this class structure develop? Normally, it’s the behavior of people with influence in the Stake or Ward — they set the tone and others follow. I also think there is some insecurity on the part of the people who feel they must broadcast their AMEX and extravagant travel.
In one Zion-like Ward, a young couple moved in from out of state. They were ALL about the status and the money. He taught gospel doctrine and actually devoted a Gospel Doctrine lesson about the economic differences in the ward — emphasizing it, polarizing it, and destroying the seamless relationships that existed (potentially). He did it under the guise of supposedly de-emphasizing class structure, but in reality, he was ALL ABOUT class structure — his BMW, his massive house, his status symbols, his high quality suits, and his good looks.
I felt inferior around him and realized it was arrogance. I felt inferior as an initial impulse. I later ended up working with him on a different, extra-church project, and it became very clear he cared about all the things that aren’t supposed to matter — appearance, wealth, property, status. People like that need social discipline…and he was very hoity toity toward people who didn’t have his status.
Fortunately, in Bishopric meeting the Bishop caught it and started questioning whether he belonged teaching Gospel doctrine as this GD teacher kept having flirtations with the topic in other lessons.
If that was my Ward, I would figure out a way of influencing that culture, perhaps through an appeal to the local leadership (hopefully they aren’t in on it). And if I felt ostracized, I probably wouldn’t go.
I have often wondered if these people would be emotionally shattered if they lost the outer trappings of their wealth. I have little respect for that aspect of their character…
I’m going to have to cut this short as I just got word that American Express has increased my limit, so now I can buy China.
I used to live in a ward that was very large geographic area that went from people with huge 2 story houses and horses to those having a hard time making the rent on a dump of an old mobile home. In that ward there was a good attempt to check the egos at the door and just help each other. Now I am in a geographically small (not SLC small) suburban ward that is fairly homogeneous. So this is not an issue.
I have not had any issues with stake leaders dropping hints about how rich they are. I have heard a few, “let me hint at how righteous I am”
amateurparent wrote:Is this a local phenomenon? Is this a church-wide trend?
I tend to think this is a local phenomenon. I don’t see it happening in my ward. Thank goodness. What I do see happening, though, in certain areas of the Salt Lake valley is the constant name dropping of General Authorities. A friend of mine lived in a stake where several apostles also lived. Neal Maxwell was in her ward. She couldn’t relate a single solitary incident that happened in church without mentioning him. For example, her son was very short for his age. When he became a deacon and started passing the sacrament, she mentioned to me how much shorter he was than all the rest of the deacons. She said, “Taylor just looked so tiny next to all of the other deacons. He really stood out. We were all just sitting and watching in amusement as the group of them stood up and walked over to the sacrament table. And there was Elder Maxwell, right up near the front of the chapel.” I wanted to say, “I’m sorry, I must have missed something. What did Elder Maxwell have to do with this?”My aunt lived in the same stake. She used to tell my mother, “People call it the ‘Celestial Stake’.” Yeah, right. Who calls it that besides you and the other status-seekers in your ward? Ugh.
There is an inordinately high number of doctors in my ward, but I have not heard things like this very often – and the couple of times I heard something about vacations didn’t come across as status-dropping. Having said that, I have seen it in some people nearly everywhere I’ve lived – inside and outside the Church.
Quote:Every time we have someone stand up to talk, and gratuitious details are added to assure us of their personal prosperity, it makes me wince.
I’ve been thinking about this, and about the name-dropping. Why did it bug the heck out of me that Elder Rasband mentioned the name Huntsman about ten times in a recent GC talk? But when Terryl Givens gives a talk about an insight that came to him looking at stained glass in Europe, I’m cool with that.
So a lot for me is just a style issue, what I think the intent of bringing up the tidbit is, and my history with the person.
AP, I see nothing like that here at all. However, I was visiting Utah last year and went to Church. Happened to be HC Sunday and the guy gave a talk that was basically “my life story and why I am the way I am” with lots of references like, “Brother Jacobsen, you remember that, of course” and “Sister Young, I always loved how your mom made treats for us when we went Fast Offering collecting”… It’s not how he intended it, I think, but his message came across completely as “I am a Mormon because I don’t know anything else”. I couldn’t get over how 1) pointless it was and 2) how it seemed totally natural to everyone in the congregation. I have to admit, it weirded me out a bit.
I can offer no solace with your experience, only commiseration.
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