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I asked this question on NOM as well and the question is as a child I really liked the idea of the cross and it representing Christianity as a member of the church I know the view on the cross but this view was not adopted until the 1950s I wonder if I were to wear a cross would anyone say anything and would their be any type of disciplinary action as far as I can tell their is no doctrine , policy , memo or anything else that states members cannot wear a cross. Thoughts on this subject ?? Not wearing or using the cross is not doctrine or policy, rather it is tradition (as you point out a more recent tradition). Would anyone say anything if you wore one? Maybe. Nobody in my ward probably would, but I certainly do know people who would, just as they would say something if you wore jeans. Discipline would be a big stretch, I think there would have to be other things involved and the overzealous leader would likely not make a point of the cross in writing. My opinion is if you want to wear a cross, go ahead and do it. I might ask myself why I am doing so – is it to express my Christianity or is it a sign of rebellion? Either is OK in my book, but if I were just trying to draw someone’s attention then I’d think about why I think that’s necessary.
Right now, at this point in my journey, when so many people in my life are looking at me with suspicion and just waiting for me to do something “anti-LDS”, this is not the right time for me to wear a cross. I think a cross is a beautiful symbol that has been unfortunately lost from our traditions, but it has been lost. It is now viewed with suspicion. You need to decide if you want to add that into your life — the cross AND the suspicion. There was a August 16th: Pick up your Cross and Follow MeIf I wore a cross to church I’d expect the following in my ward:
1) One person would
definitelypull me aside and tell me that I shouldn’t be wearing a cross. Not naming names. :shh: I’m not sure how this would work out though. If I were a recent convert I’d expect it but what if I’m someone that supposedly “knows better?”2) Two or three would notice, maybe give me a little playful ribbing, but be supportive.
3) The other two hundred wouldn’t notice.
I agree with all these thoughts. I can’t accurately express why I started wearing a small cross, and I don’t know how many people have noticed. My mother was the only one outside my household to say anything. For all I know it’s actually non-members who do the most wondering about it. (She’s LDS…so why a cross?) But at this point, it really is just part of me and I’m comfortable. I like the empty cross, the questions it prompts in my mind, what it brings to my remembrance. I get that others, my husband, for instance, would not feel the same way, but there’s been no contention about it. You make a good point about symbolism, Ann. We have lots of symbolism in the church. In our recent stake conference the visiting AA talked about symbolism when he talked about the sacrament. He mentioned the bread and water being symbolic of the body and blood of Christ, helping us to remember Him. He mentioned some other symbolism, including temple garments (he was kind of using a “remember” theme in relation to the Sabbath). I’m with you, Ann – the empty cross is symbolic to me. I have never bought the “we don’t have crosses because we focus on the living Christ” thing. The empty cross is exactly that symbolism. I’m also not opposed to the crucifix – it helps me remember the suffering of Christ. (Our AA also reminded us that the atonement was not just in Gethsemane, it was also between then and the crucifixion, the crucifixion itself, and the resurrection and we need to include all of that in discussions about he atonement.) I don’t wear a temple or Moroni tie or lapel pin, and probably wouldn’t. The cross is much more symbolic of what I believe than the temple or Moroni. FWIW, our AA also told a story of bringing someone to church where there was a long set of announcements and business, leaving 35 minutes for talks. He said a husband and wife spoke, she for 30 and he for 5. The topic was 72-hour kits. After the meeting his friend told him he knows why some people don’t consider Mormons Christian and didn’t accept any further invitations to church. He told us that he hopes we’re all prepared for emergencies/disasters, but that’s not what we should be talking about in SM.
:thumbup: DarkJedi wrote:I might ask myself why I am doing so – is it to express my Christianity or is it a sign of rebellion? Either is OK in my book, but if I were just trying to draw someone’s attention then I’d think about why I think that’s necessary.
I have a bible with a decorative leatherwork cover. There is a gold colored cross about two inches by one inch in the center of the design. I bring it to church and make sure that the design and the cross are visible when I set it down – never covered up by other books or bags. I do this in my own very small way to try to make the cross less taboo or foreign to my ward community.
I’m not exactly making a statement and could not imagine anyone complaining about my bible … unobtrusively sitting on the ground.
amateurparent wrote:Right now, at this point in my journey, when so many people in my life are looking at me with suspicion and just waiting for me to do something “anti-LDS”, this is not the right time for me to wear a cross. I think a cross is a beautiful symbol that has been unfortunately lost from our traditions, but it has been lost. It is now viewed with suspicion. You need to decide if you want to add that into your life — the cross AND the suspicion.
I also am keenly aware of walking this fine line. I do not pay tithing and can only attend SM due to work reasons. I want to baptize my children and my bishop has the final word on that issue. (Fortunately, I am approved to perform the baptism of our youngest child this Friday) I also make no secret that my family participates in other churches. If I were to wear a cross to church some busybody might assume that I am trying to proselyte or “witness” to my fellow Mormons. I suppose context and presentation can be important.
Roy wrote:I want to baptize my children and my bishop has the final word on that issue. (Fortunately, I am approved to perform the baptism of our youngest child this Friday)
:thumbup: DarkJedi wrote:… the empty cross is symbolic to me. I have never bought the “we don’t have crosses because we focus on the living Christ” thing. The empty cross is exactly that symbolism. I’m also not opposed to the crucifix – it helps me remember the suffering of Christ.
I
dounderstand how an LDS person can have an aversion to the cross, but the more I’ve thought, the more beautiful it is to me. The cross is organic, upstretched, open-armed. It’s “true,” in the sense of its right angles. A crucifix recalls the event, and I also don’t completely object to it. (How much difference is there, really, between having a crucifix and singing sacrament hymns every week that recount the physical torture, or the endowment’s heavy reference to it?) But it’s the eternal emptiness of the cross – victory from the jaws of defeat – that really moves me. Why the symbol of the cross is important in Christian theology: Quote:For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. We know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin… But if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him…So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus. –Romans 6:5-11 (NRSV)
DarkJedi wrote:Nobody in my ward probably would, but I certainly do know people who would,
just as they would say something if you wore jeans.Oh, that could get entertaining in my ward. Some of us think the current bishop was called partly to get him to quit wearing jeans to church. Didn’t work; he just got a bunch of black and khaki jeans for Sunday wear.
NightSG wrote:DarkJedi wrote:Nobody in my ward probably would, but I certainly do know people who would,
just as they would say something if you wore jeans.Oh, that could get entertaining in my ward. Some of us think the current bishop was called partly to get him to quit wearing jeans to church. Didn’t work; he just got a bunch of black and khaki jeans for Sunday wear.
That is interesting. We have one guy who regularly wears jeans with a button down shirt and no tie and I haven’t heard anyone say anything to him. Our bishop, however, is a suit and white shirt guy. One time this summer when the AC wasn’t quite working his counselor got up for the mid-meeting thing and took his jacket off – the bishop made him put it back on. There are two HCs in our ward, and I don’t know for sure about the other guy (he’s not totally orthodox) but I usually go without a jacket and wearing a non-white shirt. I have actually never seen the other guy in a white shirt, that’s why I brought it up. I partly do it to prove a point, but then again there are always several men in our ward without white shirts, including the HPGL, EQP, and YMP so I’m in good company. I may have to try the colored jeans thing. As a side note, the truth is I like white shirts so I do wear them.
Anyway, back to the topic, I think most wards have some busybodies who would get bent out of shape by a cross (or jeans or a colored short), but if my ward has one he or she keeps quiet (maybe feels outnumbered). The ward I often visit has more than its share to make up for it.
DarkJedi wrote:Anyway, back to the topic, I think most wards have some busybodies who would get bent out of shape by a cross (or jeans or a colored short), but if my ward has one he or she keeps quiet (maybe feels outnumbered).
I’ll fairly often wear black jeans with a dress shirt, tie and jacket on Sunday. Just about as often I’ll show up in a nice gray or black suit. Once in a while, I’ll do khakis and a fairly loud tan plaid jacket. I think being taller and stockier than most everybody else in the ward might keep them quiet…especially since the former EQP is one of the few guys bigger than me and also does the some-random-level-between-business-casual-and-way-too-formal thing on Sunday mornings.
Quote:The cross is a symbol of death. We like to remember the living Christ. If you read in the Bible, Christ wasn’t the only one who was killed on a cross. That was a common punishment during those times. It was what happened after his crucifixion that was the most important. He overcame death and was resurrected.
I can understand there have been good intentions and good teachings in our past that have established our mormon approach to the cross not being on our buildings or people wearing them.
Quote:“I do not wish to give offense to any of my Christian colleagues who use the cross on the steeples of their cathedrals and at the altars of their chapels, who wear it on their vestments, and imprint it on their books and other literature. But for us, the cross is the symbol of the dying Christ, while our message is a declaration of the Living Christ. …
“… The lives of our people must become the most meaningful expression of our faith and, in fact, therefore, the symbol of our worship.”
President Gordon B. Hinckley (1910–2008), “The Symbol of Our Faith,” Liahona and Ensign, April 2005, 3.I don’t disagree with the message the late great prophet taught. It seems to be what rings true for most mormons…that we want something more than a remembrance of his death.
But in all honesty, I think it has been a good teaching from past church leaders that somehow has turned a bit taboo when it doesn’t need to be. Like other things in the church, like taking the sacrament with your right hand or not wearing jeans, maybe that is something someone thought was a good idea once, but why it became so entrenched in our traditions and people being all crazy about it to pull someone aside and think it needs to be pointed out is puzzling to me.
What I really hate is the response:
Quote:If your brother was stabbed to death in a mugging, would you wear a knife around your neck? That is the same as the cross!
🙄 That’s pretty silly. Missionaries grab on to that statement like it is a mic drop…”Boom…ya, you’re wrong, that point proves it!”:wtf: So, I think it is important to recognize the temperature at church and what people have been taught and the reasons for it are not bad. Let’s celebrate Christ’s life…let’s focus on the bigger more important part of it…and be different than other christians and try harder to walk our talk about our focus and example. KNowing that is what others at the church building in your ward think…then to decide to go ahead and wear the cross is fine if you feel strong about it…but I don’t think you can expect others to not react.
I guess you just decide if you care to get a reaction or if you have more important reasons for wearing a cross that outweigh the reaction from others it will likely create.
Heber13 wrote:If your brother was stabbed to death in a mugging, would you wear a knife around your neck? That is the same as the cross!
My very TBM MIL actually told me this in a discussion that we had. Some time later she sent us a Christmas package with little nail ornaments. The nails represented miniature versions of the nails used to crucify Jesus and are intended to be hung on our tree as reminders of “The true meaning of Christmas.” I found it so incongruent as to be funny.
OTOH, it got me to thinking. Why would the cross be off limits and the nails be ok. I believe it is precisely because the cross has been taken as a symbol by a large portion of the Christian world. We as a church have had a very tense relationship with other Christian faiths. We have at times stated that their creeds were abominations, that Lucifer was the true head of all their churches, and even had a very unflattering depiction of a “creedalist” preacher in our temple ceremony. I believe that we see the cross as a symbol of apostate worship and we have been historically trying to distance or separate ourselves from that.
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