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DBMormon wrote:
I also fear with Dehlin, Rock, Calderwoods, Van Allens (almost), Kate Kelly and others being sent packing there likely isn’t as big a divide between me and what the church considers apostate anymore. I no longer feel “safe”
I am sorry DB. You have my complete respect as someone trying to reach out to the disaffected while leading with faith. I imagine it is quite hurtful to have been seen with the sinners and the taxcollectors and to have been judged guilty (or at least untrustworthy) by association. The church has need for poeple like you (and the Givens’, Bushmans, Kloostermans, and others) to bridge the gap in love.
Fwiw, DB, there is a huge difference between you and the others on that list – and it’s an important one. Old-Timer wrote:Fwiw, DB, there is a huge difference between you and the others on that list – and it’s an important one.
The question though is could every leader tell that difference. I am no longer confident that they can. For example yesterday at Church I was asked If my wife and I could meet with the Bishop on Tuesday. I am 99% sure it is a calling (primary teacher is my guess…. how do I say no?) and yet my stomach dipped a little worried that Salt Lake has asked him to talk to us.
DBMormon wrote:Old-Timer wrote:Fwiw, DB, there is a huge difference between you and the others on that list – and it’s an important one.
The question though is could every leader tell that difference. I am no longer confident that they can. For example yesterday at Church I was asked If my wife and I could meet with the Bishop on Tuesday. I am 99% sure it is a calling (primary teacher is my guess…. how do I say no?) and yet my stomach dipped a little worried that Slat Lake has asked him to talk to us.
I sure hope it is a primary calling.I do see what you are saying. You have had others that you could clearly say, “I am coming from a WAY more faithfully oriented perspective than Dehlin, Rock, …” Several of those are being removed from the church, leaving you looking (at least to a TBM) that you are a bit more “out there”.
I can only say to keep doing some podcasts that show you are not trying to tear the church down.
I can personally say that if they do come after you, I will be coming “out” and speaking (not under a pseudonym, but in the clear) that the church is hurting themselves and being overly sensitive to
anycriticism. To this point most people that know me know me in the ward and stake know that I had a FC, but I am still very orthodox and they think I am back to the way I was a few years ago. But other than online I have kept it to myself. I agree with Ray, there is a difference in level of professed faith and in the level of open criticism between what I read from you and what I read from the others you mention, Bill. DarkJedi wrote:I agree with Ray, there is a difference in level of professed faith and in the level of open criticism between what I read from you and what I read from the others you mention, Bill.
I agree that Bill is not the same as them. However I can also see how Bill’s concern could be valid. He has a podcast in which he discusses some controversial issues. Some of the ideas and possible solutions that get discussed are unorthodox. How unorthodox would he be allowed to be before it made his local leadership uncomfortable? I do not envision any official discipline as that would seem to involve more investigation and balanced consensus. But unofficially … If a Sunday School teacher can be released for teaching from the church essays – what might happen to an unorthodox podcaster?
I don’t disagree, Roy. Leadership roulette can certainly play a role here and being in a new place I would probably be a little leery as well. Quote:Roy wrote: He has a podcast in which he discusses some controversial issues. Some of the ideas and possible solutions that get discussed are unorthodox. How unorthodox would he be allowed to be before it made his local leadership uncomfortable?
A few weeks ago, when my TBM friend decided to corner/ambush/lecture me, I felt that ANYTHING I said would have been interpreted as apostate. I could’ve explained the articles of faith one by one .. or gone over the temple interview questions and she would have interpreted them as apostate.
Someone with a podcast — certain people will interpret anything associated with a non-church affiliate podcast as evil.
Remember the old term Witch Hunt?
DarkJedi wrote:I agree with Ray, there is a difference in level of professed faith and in the level of open criticism between what I read from you and what I read from the others you mention, Bill.
I hope so!
DBM, you said: Quote:My local ward and stake seem to be hesitant to let me closer than arms length.
Do you know you Bishop well? When you visit with him, why not ask him a direct question. Are your feelingsvalid? Do I have anything to be concerned with from the Stake or SLC? I would want to know. You may be worrying about nothing. You also said:
Quote:and yet my stomach dipped a little worried that Salt Lake has asked him to talk to us.
There was a period in my life where I thought that I was going to be fired at work. I worried & thought about it
for along time. I finally talked to my boss & she said that no, I am not going to be fired. She reassured me that I
was doing a good job. I wasted a lot of time, effort & emotion. I’ve read almost all of your postings here & you
have been very balanced & fair.
DBMormon wrote:On facebook, my uncle n law chimes in, disagrees, but never supports his need to fix me with substance. On some of my posts a few members of FAIRMormon have made comments. A prominent scholar in the area of polygamy has said some mean things privately to me simply because I disagreed with him. and My local ward and stake seem to be hesitant to let me closer than arms length. Besides that though all is well in Zion.
😆 Awakening wrote:I am among friends here who do understand.
Or, we at least know what it’s like to bemisunderstood, so we probably try extra hard to understand each other. Nothing in that blog really spoke to me, but that’s not because she’s not a nice, well-meaning person.
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