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Since many of us see the world much differently than traditional Mormons, I would like to pose the question to you — what does eternal progression mean to you? Specifically, what do you believe you are becoming, and what will eternal progression enable you to do? I don’t mean this to be snarky or simplistic, but I define eternal progression as “progressing eternally” or “never-ending, ascending evolution of some kind”. I see our overarching theology as embracing multiple “stages of creation” – or multiple “points of evolutionary change” – and I take that basic construct and apply it to things beyond just physical development, including love, understanding, patience, scientific knowledge, expanding familial relationships, etc. Theologically, for me, that means becoming more and more god-like – as vague as that is.
Old-Timer wrote:“never-ending, ascending evolution of some kind”.
This is the heart of what I think you said, along with it being vague, and the answer to my question.
For me, it means:
Quote:eternally improving in my ability to turn vision into sustained reality, through the wise use of power.
For me, it encompasses a whole host of noble ideas, such as good character, technical knowledge, experience, the ability to sustain hard work over a long period of time, etcetera. I think this is implied by D&C 121 that talks about our “kingdom flowing unto us without compulsory means” as one of the outcomes of a progressive life. It talks about influence gained through righteous means/power, which implies getting people to do things, or working through people to bring about some objective. And it implies that one must achieve objectives through methods that respect others. I think this is also consistent with the messages I’ve gotten out of the temple ceremony.
I think God’s mission — “to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man” demonstrates that changing reality in some way is an important part of progression, and ended up being His ultimate work.
I agree, SD – and think we are saying the same thing. I agree with Ray and SD – but I will put my own slant to it nonetheless. I believe that I am becoming my “ultimate self.”
This term is quite vague but I believe it to mean the apex of all my good attributes and the minimization or management of all my negative qualities. I do not believe it is possible to remove my less flowery traits and even if they could be excised – would the left over product still be recognizable as me?
Being my ultimate self helps me to build better relationships with the people I care about. It would help me to be a better father and husband without my selfishness getting in the way as much.
What does that mean eternally? I have hope that I will continue in some form after this life. I have hope that I will be able to associate in some form with my loved ones in that state. If personal interactions are at all similar in that place then these interactions could be seen as a process of giving and receiving. I hope to become a continually better giver and a continually better receiver.
Could you say that you are simply on a path of eternal self actualization? To quote Maslow… SilentDawning wrote:Could you say that you are simply on a path of eternal self actualization? To quote Maslow…
I think so, SD, but perhaps in a bigger way than envisioned by Maslow. I generally agree with what others have said about eternal progression being just what it sounds like. I think it’s very much like the Buddhist view of enlightenment or the Hindu view of Nirvana, except that it’s not an end state. That’s where I get stuck on the whole eternal progression thing. Isn’t there only so far one can progress? I know this goes along with the human inability to comprehend endlessness or eternity, but I’m not sure there is no end. I get the “eternal round” thing, but that really just seems repetitive to me, like the background in Hanna Barbara cartoons.
For me it means as long as I experience consciousness (in this life or after) I will have the ability to learn new things. If that were not the case I would be damned. What does eternal progression mean to you? That society gets better and better with the passage of time. That the people that come after me live in a better world than the one I lived in. There’s no guarantee and is something that must be worked toward but as you can tell, I don’t play a very large role in that.
See — to me, eternal progression is vague. As a goal setter, you start out vague, but then it has to made concrete in some way — otherwise you don’t know what you are aspiring to. I think the LDS Gospel makes it clear that we are progressing toward a state of personal righteousness, learning and power that will eventually allow us to create worlds and populate them. It’s not vague. in my view.
I might be a bit of an outlier in making this statement, but eternal progression is why I don’t believe that God is omnipotent but rather subject to natural laws. The way I see it he is a more advanced being, but maybe he doesn’t know everything either, just a whole lot more than people at our stage. Compare what a person knew in the middle ages to what we all have instant access to today via the internet. We would look like Gods to them (most of whom were illiterate also). Similar to HG, I think the eternities is something I am not able to comprehend, and therefore see some of those things (like God, or progression, or CK) as best I can from my lowly vantage point. So God is as omnipotent as I can comprehend omnipotence. If He is still progressing and therefore not completely omnipotent, I wouldn’t ever be able to notice. Therefore, He will always be my God, and I can always trust Him.
To me, eternal progression is to keep loving. Just because I love others (like my kids, for example), I don’t just stay at the same place every day as I love them. Each new experience presents new ways to love them. At times I can’t imagine loving them any more, but then new experiences help me keep progressing and enjoy more, and add to the love I previously had. So, part of the progression isn’t elevated or higher love…just more love through more experience.
I translate that to my thoughts on eternal progression. Relationships progress.
I think of it as a bit of continuous improvement, but then that makes me feel tired and kind of like this poster 
[img]http://demotivators.despair.com/demotivational/qualitydemotivator.jpg [/img] except that even death does not end the march.
I like that picture. I know that feeling of being broken but seeing the road stretch out ahead of you, knowing you aren’t close to being done yet. A finish line creates a goal that can either be met or not met. Crossing that finish line marks progress and that can create feelings of satisfaction; that same satisfaction can turn into despair when the finish line turns out to be further away than we though.
Eternal progression would imply that we’ll never cross a finish line, if we are to find any satisfaction it won’t be in arriving at a set destination. My answer is to (strain to) find satisfaction in the journey itself. I enjoy learning, I wouldn’t enjoy knowing everything.
If the runner enjoys running, enjoy it while it lasts.
I think Mormonism reduces Heavenly Father to a weakling sometimes… what’s the point in worshipping a weakling? I don’t think God is in fact like that. While I can see the point in progression, eternal progression means nothing. You will eventually reach a point at which you are all powerful, otherwise we’re just like a donkey with a carrot dangled in front of it, which never seems to quite reach it.
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