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scthomas34 wrote:DevilsAdvocate wrote:
However, the truth is that people lived as hunter/gatherers much longer than they have had developed agriculture so it doesn’t make sense to me why we should expect that everyone would quickly adapt to some of the radical and more recent changes in diet especially enough to make something like wheat of all things the “staff of life” that people should supposedly base their entire diet around when it only grows well in specific temperate climates. We already know that there are genetic differences in terms of what health problems some people are more susceptible to than others so I don’t see what is so unusual about the fact that some people are more vulnerable to overeating and the impact of certain types of carbohydrate foods than others. Basically it looks to me like D&C 89 has it backwards and it would actually be a better idea in general for people to plan their meals around some source of protein and eat grains and potatoes sparingly, if at all, because that’s what will typically satisfy their hunger longer.
Again, this is another faulty assumption. Hunting, just does not pay off on a regular basis for that to be a main staple. It was really a lot more gathering than it was hunting. The great apes of primarily gatherers.
If it were true that humans were hunters gathers than it would show in our body plan. Chimpanzees are 95% vegatarian with way bigger canine teeth than we have. Their only protein really is terminites and some other bugs. If we were hunters for so long than our body would have adapted natural-selected for these traits for this diet, our teeth more pincer-like, not more deer like, our cheekbones more dog-like, not reduced, as they our now. Form follows function, that’s how evolution and adaptation works.I feel that the meaning is more important than the literal word for word verse in D & C when it comes to grains, it is clear that grain and herbs of the field are very important, be it wheat, rice, oaks, corn, or whatever.
I’m not saying people should be carnivores, my point was simply that meat has been a part of people’s diet longer than they have been growing wheat, rice, corn, etc. so the fact that many people still react better to meat without overeating than some of these newer food sources isn’t necessarily that unusual or unexpected. What sounds like a false assumption to me is the idea that the fact that people don’t have different teeth and other physiological changes somehow proves that meat isn’t any good for them. Think about it; it’s not like they needed to be able to grab a zebra or whatever by the throat with their teeth like a lion, they already had spears and other hand tools they could use instead of teeth and claws. So as long as they could digest meat well enough to be able to pass their genes on to future generations then any genetic variations to optimize meat consumption even more would have been no real competitive advantage and there is no reason whatsoever that we should expect to see differences like this no matter how much meat they typically consumed.
scthomas34 wrote:A vegeratarian diet does not mean a good diet. Some vegetarian diets are worse than animal protein based ones. A good diet is 90% of ones diet being foods that whole grain, fruits, and vegetables and highly processed foods, dairy, meats and junk to less than 10% of ones total calories.
If you really want to see what a diet of unrefined plants foods will do for you than I suggest completely getting on it for three months and see what it does and how you feel and also look at your cholesterol now and weight and compare it in three months.Just incorporating whole grain breads and cereals, while leaving everything else the same is like going from 6 packs of cigarettes to 4 and expecting to see all of the benefits of no smoking, you have to go all the way…This especially important if you going to based your whole testimony of the Word of Wisdom on your own anecdotal experience just a couple of experience when you have not accounted for all of the factors going into the before and after….unrefined plant food diet takes people back to their high school weight…Someone show me a meat based diet that can reverse heart disease, the number killer in our country… I don’t really want to obsess about diet and health that much. My main concern was simply that I don’t want to frequently feel hungry while gaining weight the way I did when I thought my diet was already healthy based on what D&C 89 says and other questionable advice I had heard like the old food pyramid. I am already satisfied with the results I am getting from eating moderate amounts of meat and watching the amount and types of carbs I eat. Also, there is more to food and drink than their basic function and trying to find the best possible diet in terms of health as if it is some kind of contest or race. For example, most desserts are clearly not the best possible thing to eat but people will continue to eat them mostly because it is something they enjoy. If you take all or most of the enjoyment out of life then what are you really left with? To me it’s more about trying to find a balance I can live with and feel good about overall than focusing mostly on one isolated consideration like what is always the best possible thing to eat and drink in terms of health. So I doubt I will ever stop eating meat but even if I did I still think something like beans would be a better staple food over the long term than wheat, potatoes, etc. because they contain more protein and fiber.
I won’t drag this post on anymore since I think we both feel we have thoroughly worn it out. I would say though that the switch to a diet with very little animal products has not been as big a shift as my wife and I have thought and the life style is not really that different. We got burnt out on bean dishes really fast, but we have found better tasting replacements. We have replaced our reg cheese with almost cheese, milk with almond milk, and of course veggie burgers, tofu mayonaise. We have to say that most things are not really that different, soy salad with tofu mayonaise taste a heck of a lot like chicken salad. A lot more salads, and whole grain cereals and quinoa dishes. Be more important we eat a lot more cultural dishes, food that is more adventorous, which is a lot different than the standard american 7 dish rotation diet. I know you didn’t ask for this info and a lot of members of this ward are probably rolling their eyes, but I just wanted to put the info out there if anyone gets to the point where the doctor wants them largely off their meat because of heart disease or other reasons, their are ways out their have healthy food that tastes good. There are a number of desserts as well that are can healthy and taste. There are some meats that have good effects like those with omega 3s, salmon etc. And Oysters have are loaded with minerals that are sometimes hard to get in other sources. I cooked an awesome Tucson, veggie and bean soup tonight, olive garden quality, with a 7 leaf salad, arugula, raddichio, butterhead, romaine, spinach. Take care 🙂
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