- This topic is empty.
-
Posts
-
I thought I had long since resolved my inner debate with church/gospel/letter of the law spirit of the law etc. raised in the church with a few major obstacles to my own conversion as an adult. My spouse was 100% responsible for my second chance towards the church as an organization. Our family battles daily with the impacts of mental illness — from the patient’s perspective and the caregivers. I am so tired of listening to speeches on answers to prayer, personal revelation, when the core of mental illness impacts both mind and heart … how do you know what is “guidance” and what is ‘another moment for drugs’.
The lack of support from the local leaders no longer makes me angry as much as it saddens me and makes me feel as if the gospel is for all — just not those with burdens and challenges beyond the “average bear”, those that do not impose time constraints or those who have problems that can fit into 15 minute slots on Sunday.
If one more person tells me that they’ve put our names on prayer rolls at the temple, or fasted for us I will scream. I too have fasted, prayed, spent hours in the temple, and yet the bottom line questions remain, how can you live a life based on “prayer” “faith” and other emotionally based actions, when there is real concern for the source of any thought/answer etc.
A friend suffers from mental illness as well, and I regret the frustration I shared towards her over the years as she would turn frequently to home teachers, bishops, stake presidents, for blessings and support. Well, it doesn’t seem that the culture offers that same shepherding for both genders. Or maybe the male ego isn’t open to received.
I’m not sure why I’m writing. I’ve been searching for an outlet, for somewhere to chat for a long time and came across this site.
Has anyone found a good resource within the organization that can help in the day/day mortality of it all when one isn’t blessed with the same mental capacities as the average bear? Some times I just need to ‘talk’ — not fix, not tell me that ‘in the next life all will be balanced’, and I need someone to listen who will not then view my spouse as less than whole. Does that exist within the structure of the organization? I guess I’m trying to figure out how anything I hear on Sunday applies to me and my family here and now.
thanks.
Ashleigh, I’m glad you took the courage to talk and get it out. Your questions are really good ones.
I actually deal with this issue in my family, so I TOTALLY get what you are saying about prayer and fasting and spritual support and medication.
Quote:Has anyone found a good resource within the organization that can help in the day/day mortality of it all when one isn’t blessed with the same mental capacities as the average bear?
I’m not sure I know what specifically you are looking for in regards to a resource. But I believe many of us deal with mental health issues in one way or another. So it is not so different…maybe just different levels of severity and a test of faith on how to make sense of it.
For me, as I said I deal with it in my family personally, I have found that I can find peace with it all for me personally. I do not know how to help others, except to love them.
The big thing is to find a place of peace for yourself…then you can help others. If you want to post specific questions on this forum board or personal message me directly, I’d be happy to share my experiences with you, as I’m sure others would also. These issues run deep and are very common across most wards in the church. (not to downplay your situation at all, but to try to empathize with you that sharing with others is a good place to start for finding your peace).
Welcome to the forum!
Mental illness is one of those areas that I don’t think many in this world understand. I think that is why the church started LDSSS because bishops, SP’s, and RS don’t have the understanding or credentials to handle this fully, yet they know that help is needed. I don’t know how many times I have had to remind myself (in my own situation) that bishop’s are not therapists. And I don’t know exactly where my expectations should lie with regards to the church and these issues. There are parts to our problems that people can help with and other parts we just have to carry alone. Certainly talking to someone who is properly informed is better than trying to explain to the ignorant. And sometimes when people don’t understand, they can be painful. My own situation is something that no very many people tolerate well. That is a sad truth to me some days, but I have decided that it is ok. Maybe it is people like you that have been thru the mental illness wilderness to help the rest of us “get it”. Maybe you are the one who is appointed to come back and expand the rest of us who will certainly protest or avoid the lesson. I don’t know.
What I do know is that peace has come to me from the inside out. Not the other way around. It is how I think and react and evaluate myself, my situation, and others that determines my level of acceptance and peace. I don’t need the acceptance of others to feel ok anymore — well at least that is my goal. And now, I can greet someones misunderstanding with love and maybe even a little education to help them love too.
I think people put our names in the temple because they simply don’t know what else to do, but they do want to do something. It is the default setting for many of us. My mother did the same thing, bless her heart. But it really was all the capacity she had to give. SO, I decided to accept the gesture anyway even though it felt like a copout some days. The love sent was something even if it wasn’t everything.
Just know you aren’t alone. Maybe we need more support groups so that we know we aren’t alone. And people can think what they want, but it doesn’t make it all true. We are GOOD, no matter what burden it is that we have to carry. Burdens don’t define us! I refuse to believe that. Maybe this next generation will be filled with more understanding, tolerance, and capacity for loving those who don’t fall into the mainstream.
Much love to you.
@ashleigh1953 Welcome. I know a thing or two about mental illnesses. My mom has been (at one time or another) diagnosed with just about every mental illness disorder known to man. No, seriously, I’m being serious. I grew up with it, went through all kinds of stages with my mother: hate, love, resent, tolerance, and back to love. I’m very familiar with dealing with these problems, and I think I personally am a bit prone to depression although I think I deal with it fairly well.
Anyway, you asked for an outlet, and I don’t know of one. But if you’re interested, I would be happy to listen and talk with you. Feel free to contact me at
justin@justyntime.com if you’re interested.My heart goes out to you. My son has recently been diagnosed with bipolar and spent months in the hospital. No one can understand the heartache until you have been through this. I too felt like “How could God do this to us?” “Why get blessing after blessing to no avail?” It was confusing and at times I felt totally in the dark. I had to make a conscious choice to hang on to the truth and prove to God that I had faith in Him even in the dark. Slowly I have come out of that darkness – I have tried to see what I can learn from this experience, I have tried to be grateful for any tiny improvement and good thing in my life, I have gained great empathy for anyone that suffers, I have gained new insights into the atonement to know that Jesus Christ suffered not only for our sins but for our pain and sickness. He will take this all away. Life is only a short moment and the older I get the more I can see how fragile and short. My son suffers still, the meds are terrible, but his wife is loving to him, he is able to work a little and many people have been kind. Almost everyone I know has very hard things they are dealing with. My son has shown great courage and my love for him has increased even more than I thought possible. I am starting to understand that sometimes our prayers and blessings are answered in the Lord’s time and in his way, but they are answered. I love you! Awww. I was thinking you need a friend. You should take jmb up on his offer (he is cool). It is good to have someone who can agree with how crappy life can be but also offer support in a positive direction when needed. I have a friend who is sick and gets really tired of people telling her to just think positive. I think it goes along with the people who say “it’s all for the best” or “God’s will” when you suffer a loss. Many people just don’t know what it is like and are unable to know what to say and do. I think it is helpful to realize that these people just don’t know what is helpful so they say and do the only thing they can think of.
just me wrote:Many people just don’t know what it is like and are unable to know what to say and do. I think it is helpful to realize that these people just don’t know what is helpful so they say and do the only thing they can think of.
Well said, just me. Advice like “Don’t worry, be happy” and “Pray and have faith God will take away your burden” does not universally work…some people have real issues physically or mentally that are difficult for others who have not experienced to understand. To some degree, everyone has emotional issues or mood swings, and mental and spiritual effort can help in most cases…so some people think “I don’t run to the doctor everytime I cough…sometimes I just have to get better on my own” and don’t realize how different some situations are and how real those are. Once you’ve witnessed it (like the way jmb expressed it), you know differently. IMO.
My mother has a form of schizophrenia. When she is on meds that work, she is a wonderful woman – a paragon of virtue and obviously Celestial Kingdom bound. When her meds stop working, she is a monster. I believe with all my heart that the sweet angel who raised me is my real “Mommy”, and that the Atonement covers the person she becomes without the meds – the person she simply didn’t choose to be but is because of Adam’s transgression.
The Second Article of Faith is my favorite of all – and one of my favorite aspects of all Mormonism. I also think it is one of the least understood aspects of our theology.
Thank you for your comments. I will take JM up on his offer – off line — and would appreciate the opportunity to help anyone esle that I can. I would like to think that there is some reason/purpose for this adventure. I know exactly how you feel. My wife struggles with severe and chronic depression. Meds helped for a while, but now all they do is keep her from totally crashing. There is never a modicum of wellness, and the meds bring their own side affects with them. Our RS leadership knew enough of a problem exists in the ward that it would be good to try and help people gain awareness, so, they had a really good speaker come for a fifth Sunday presentation. The presentation went well, but afterwards it was just a joke to many of the ward members. I heard lots of guffaws in several meetings, both open meetings and in ward correlation. This is kind of hard to take when you live with someone with the life-threatening condition of depression. It’s just as life-threatening as cancer or heart disease, only it’s not visible and it’s not accepted.
Even when people know there is a problem, they can’t talk about it. We’ve had many home teachers, visiting teachers and bishops who were aware, but just skirt the issue. I know they are not prepared to deal with it. I don’t think there is a way they can deal with it. I was an Executive Secretary for a bishop and we had a person with some mental health issues come in and talk to him. Apparently the experience didn’t go so well, because the bishop informed me that he never wanted to talk to this person without her spouse present again. I kind of knew where we stood after that and haven’t mentioned it much.
I have not found a lot of support within the church, but we found some peace and assistance in a good counselor. She really helped me understand that my role is as caregiver, that I need to nurture myself, and that it’s in the best long-term interests of my family for me to do so. I have had to come to the realization that I can’t accept really heavy callings, because of the caregiver load, and that it’s not particularly productive to try and explain it to leadeship, but I’ve gotten to a point of being comfortable with my course. She also taught me a lot about what useful guilt is and what useless guilt is. I also learned about the grieving process (from a lost expectation of life) and how to work to come to grips with new expectations.
We have always struggled with the faith, prayer and read the scriptures solution to mental illness, which is so often proffered as the foolproof answer to everything by leadership. Done it for years and things just get worse. If I dig down deep inside of me, it is perhaps one of the roots of my reaons for being here on this site. I don’t feel a lot of answers have come other than this is our problem for life and we’re going to have to deal with it.
I guess one thing that helps is just knowing you are not alone, in fact, as I get older and more experienced, I see that mental illness is actually very prevelant and problem for many families. Hang in there.
silentstruggle, thank you so much for sharing your experience. Your story and your attitude is an inspiration to me. I 100% agree with you, that support can be given by the church, but the real resources to help in these situations is to be found outside the church, with professionals. Bishops are faced with it quite a bit…but they are seldom qualified to really help.
Can I ask you…dealing with this with your wife…does it impact your testimony or your comfort of the plan of salvation? Just curious.
Hi Ash, My own Dear Spouse suffered horribly from severe mental illness. It damaged his brain and he is now what people describe as a shell. Personally, I believe that all of the electrical shock treatments and excess sedatives hastened his demise.
Learning that his mental illness was a genetic, inheritable disease and that two of my three children suffered from it, I turned to a renown Molecular Psychiatrist for assistance. My children are doing very well, thanks. Molecular Psychiatry is a very young science, fairly new to the United States. Most of its practitioners are now at the University of California, LA. I live in Salt Lake City, Utah where we have no practitioners, but we have a large laboratory where we can do most of the diagnostics.
I am not a Medical Doctor. I have no license. I must not diagnose or prescribe over the internet, that is illegal. I think I can tell you that I do like the standard Orthomolecular Diet for many conditions. For schizophrenia and bipolar disorders, we like to achieve what is called modulation at the N-Methyl-D-Aspartate Site in the brain.
Ok, I have just blown most of you away!!!!! This little regulatory site in the brain governs the level of three major neurotransmitters (chemicals that nerve cells use to communicate). Those neurotransmitters are dopamine, serotonin and norephinephrine. The N-Methyl-D-Aspartate receptor complex has tiny calcium ion channels. It uses the influx of calcium ions to regulate the level of these three major neurotransmitters. Magnesium is the natural calcium ion channel blocker. In the “resting” state, the calcium ion channel is closed or blocked by one magnesium ion. In certain persons with schizophrenia or bipolor disorder, the calcium channel is just wide open, no magnesium blocking the channel. Calcium ions are just moving through without any regulation. A flood of calcium ions rushing through the calcium ion channel is actually a signal for the nerve cell of commit cellular suicide (apocytosis). Rule number one – never let calcium ion channels sit wide open!!!
There are many reasons why calcium ion channels sit open in so many people. A certain number of people have a genetic disorder where they have more glucocorticosteroids than mineral corticosteroids and are losing intracellular magnesium. They don’t have enough of the buffer, L-taurine, to keep the magnesium in their cells because they can’t properly process their sulfur containing amino acids. Anyway, it is very complicated. There are all sorts of reasons why people can’t keep their calcium ion channels closed. These Molecular Psychiatrists taught me how to keep calcium ion channels closed when in the resting state.
There was a bunch of other stuff that we had to do. It wasn’t easy. It wasn’t fast. Both my son and daughter had several psychiatric hospitalizations. They got behind in school. I got very discouraged. The State of Utah told me that I couldn’t send my son to public school. They tried to put him on a waiting list for institutionalization. They threatened to take him from me. They said that he wouldn’t progress in therapy because he wasn’t speaking and that the therapist made no progress because my son was mute.
The day after he started his molecular therapy, he began to speak. My daughter recovered very well and has traveled (all expenses) paid to Hawaii and Boston, Massachusetts as an advocate for the mentally ill. She also recently spoke at the University of Utah. When I see my daughter, I see a living miracle. She is all I could ever hope for in a young women. She is beautiful, intelligent and so loving. She lives on her own and helps others with neurological disorders live independently. We grow a little bit each day.
As far as help from the Church goes, I don’t think that the Church leaders are physicians – at least not most of them. I found that there were very few Psychiatrists that could even diagnose my family correctly, let alone treat them. I think that I was just going to the wrong doctors. We were getting sedatives, using electrical shock treatments and other “treatments” that just seemed to make the problem worse. When I prayed, I had a very strong feeling to go with the newer, but more experimental treatments. I think that God answered my prayers by leading me to the right doctors.
Hi MWallace, Ashleigh and silentstruggle, I am so touched by your stories and feel such compassion for what you have gone through. Having dealt with mental illness for my entire life, first with my mom and then myself after kids, I have held on to two important truths about mental illness.
First, I am encouraged and hopeful that most of the world’s brilliant minds have dealt with some form of mental illness or learning differences. IMO in many ways people who do not fit into the “norm” mentally are able to tap into other-and often beautiful-resources that others cannot. This is not to say that there is not real pain in mental illness, but this is just one of my hopeful thoughts on the subject.
Second, as an undergrad, I had the amazing opportunity to take my psychology classes from a wonderful LDS counselor who reiterated to us repeatedly that mental illness was a disease of the body just like diabetes. We were in a predominantly Mormon town, so he would emphasize that it would be absurd to suggest to someone with diabetes that they should pray more and exercise more faith in order to be healed.
I do wish there was greater understanding amongst members of the church in this area. I just think that unless you have dealt with it in some way in your own life, it is so difficult to understand. People honestly think you can will such things away, or that “giving in” to mental illness is a sign of personal weakness. It is so unfortunate, but I hope that you find comfort in knowing how many people on this site deal with the some of the same things, I know I do.
thank you for your kind words. The shared experiences are helpful. The good days are farther between now, the seasons changing will have a big impact negatively I’m sure. Most days I understand the ‘big’ picture, the eternal scope on things, I’m just not sure anyone – outside of those invovled – has a clue what it is really like day/day/day/day/day .. thank you for your words of encouragement. .. this morning I really needed them.
overit wrote:I do wish there was greater understanding amongst members of the church in this area. I just think that unless you have dealt with it in some way in your own life, it is so difficult to understand. People honestly think you can will such things away, or that “giving in” to mental illness is a sign of personal weakness. It is so unfortunate, but I hope that you find comfort in knowing how many people on this site deal with the some of the same things, I know I do.
Well said, overit! I think before I had to deal with it directly and really come to understand it, I did view the pills as an escape or cop-out for dealing with life, and if you were strong, you should just buck up and face life’s difficulties. No I clearly see how naive I was, and your example of diabetes is a great comparison. Perhaps praying for help comes by helping direct a person to a doctor or counselor…but I don’t think God just takes these tests away from us, but my hope and faith is He hears our prayers and gives us strength to deal with them responsibly. I doubt sometimes if my prayers are heard…but I keep holding on to faith that God can intervene when needed, and not intervene when He knows we can do it on our own.ashleigh1953 wrote:The good days are farther between now, the seasons changing will have a big impact negatively I’m sure. Most days I understand the ‘big’ picture, the eternal scope on things, I’m just not sure anyone – outside of those invovled – has a clue what it is really like day/day/day/day/day ..
I think you are right…outsiders don’t really know how hard it is day after day. I also believe, like you said, the seasons greatly impact it and those things are real, not made up in people’s minds. If it helps, in my experience, what I’ve tried to do is let go of some things and realize a person can only do so much. So if it takes all the energy to deal with the mental illness, and it leaves less energy or desire to actively serve in the church…in my opinion, God understands and doesn’t require we do more than we can handle. God bless you.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.