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It seemed liked when I decided to be less orthodox I was more open to starting a relationship with God, looking forward to it even. I have always had a repulsion to the idea, I use to think it was because I didn’t feel good enough. Now I don’t know what it is, but I don’t want to know him, or talk to him. I do on a surface level, on the level that I trying to do what is right and make the best of my life. Deep down I fight it, my heart is hardened to it. I don’t want to pray, I don’t want to read scriptures, I go to church out of obligation on many levels, but not to have a relationship with my maker. My mom was dx with cancer as I said in a previous post. I was just getting over a big huge trial, and things finally felt normal when this happened. It is an aggressive cancer, and the prognosis is not that good. The deeper into this it goes, the more I don’t want to pray, the more it bothers me when people tell me all I can do is pray for her. I feel like it is almost a rebellious feeling. I don’t feel slighted is the thing, I am pretty blessed despite the fact that the crap continually keeps hitting the fan in my live, and is not letting up.I know bad things happen, trials happen, and people don’t live forever, and bodies break down. I know that so I am not sure that I am mad at God. Pride, maybe, or talking to someone you might not know is there maybe. The need to push against the things people push on me. Has anyone felt like this before. Does it take some sort of life lesson to finally get over it? Is it age, I am in my 20’s so not very old. I can see why now people are atheists, it seems easier to make peace with no one being there, and figure what happens after death happens, and make peace that you have no idea what that means. I think that if religion wasn’t so entangled in my life I would probably just head that direction. Then again I want to make all this be something more than randomness, something worth while. If that is the point, I should at least give it a shot. Why do I have to fight it? *I have made many edits and I keep finding errors in this, I haven’t been sleeping well, and it is late so forgive the grammar which I have just thrown out the window.
brynngal wrote:I think that if religion wasn’t so entangled in my life
I wonder if there’s a way for you to separate your concept of God from your concept of religion.
I’ve definitely felt like you in the past and, for me, I discovered that I needed to form my concept of God based around my concept of myself; instead of the concept of God taught to me my whole life.
My thinking being that if God created me the way I am, and I believe that the good in my is from Him…
Quote:I am in my 20’s so not very old.
Patience, my child.
:ugeek: 
I think you fight it because you haven’t found yourself spiritually yet. How could you? You are in your 20’s!
The only advice I can give right now is to take the standard works and read through them with as close to a blank slate as you can. Try to focus strictly on the words themselves and understanding what you think those words are saying. Keep open all options, including: 1) this is myth – a story that was handed down orally for hundreds or thousands of years and got embellished over time (particularly with the OT – for me, like Noah’s flood being world-wide and a literal Garden of Eden); 2) this is political propaganda – a story that was inserted to explain why things were done in the past (for me, like the massacre of thousands of men, women and children in the OT being credited to a command from God; 3) this is the best recollection of long-ago events (like much of the book of Mormon and the NT); 4) this is influenced by the biases of the time (pretty much everything); 5) this is inspired by God (for me, much more than skeptics accept); 5) this feels like it came straight from God (for me, a reasonable amount, but absolutely a very small percentage); 6) some other category.
Do this so that you personally, as much as possible apart from other influnces, can begin to understand how you personally see God and religion. It’s not easy, and it’s not quick, but the large majority of people with whom I have worked who do this fully (not just partially) find a way to reconcile their views with continued involvement in the Church –
mostly because that involvement becomes on their own terms. Those whom I have seen leave and remain bitter either have not started this process or have short-circuited it midway through as they found things that challenged their previous paradigm. It takes patience, but the result is worth the effort. brynngal wrote:Has anyone felt like this before.
Pretty much every damn day. You’re going to get all sorts of advice (Patience, my child) to pray, read your scriptures, pay your tithing and do your visiting teaching and all will be well. Most of it can help but sometimes it’s just a matter of remembering that you’re not alone in this. Don’t be shy about letting someone share the load. You’ve done it for others and they’ll be happy to return the favor. And eventhough you’re young enough to be my child, you’re all grown up and you’ll do fine, IMHO.
Quote:it seems easier to make peace with no one being there
Actually, I don’t think this is necessarily the case. Believe me, I’ve been there.
Quote:I discovered that I needed to form my concept of God based around my concept of myself; instead of the concept of God taught to me my whole life
This resonated for me as well. The other thing that helped me is to envision God as the “benevolent universe” rather than a personified being and to seek to attune myself with the benevolence of the universe through meditation / prayer. That is what has worked for me.
Brynngal, it is hard isn’t it? I know how you are feeling. It becomes a deeply personal and internal struggle. In that, there is growth. Some people aren’t ready to deal with it in their 20s, and put it off…but I think those feelings will always be there until they get at you enough you decide to address them. My approach when I had similar feelings was to follow Alma 32 and test things. It was a way to figure out what means something to me and what doesn’t. I tried to take things one at a time so I didn’t overwhelm myself. What did I think of God? What about prophets and scriptures? What about prayer? What about temples? What about Word of Wisdom? What about Tithing? What about attending church? What about other religions? What about living without religion?
One thing at a time, with the most important things first, and always with the end goal of how to find peace so I can be a better husband and father. Instead of being stagnant worrying about all the things that bothered me or that I wanted to rebel against, I just put some things on a shelf while I worked on one thing at a time, and allowed myself to not do some things for a time (see D&C 50:40 and MSH 4:27). It has helped me find peace, I think because now my faith is my own…what I have deconstructed and then built back up not because it was taught to me or I feared them or I felt obligated to be a specific mormon way…but because now I could take those things I have been taught all my life and apply the ones that really really mean something to me now. And I can allow myself to let go of the others (or shelf them for a while).
It takes a lot of effort, and it takes time, and I think it takes faith that you believe you are smart enough to find peace and hope no matter what others say…but as Ray said, it ends up being so much deeper and meaningful…that now I love my testimony, even if I don’t pray that much, haven’t been to the temple in 2 years, and love the study of buddhism in the mountains on Sunday on occasion instead of church.
brynngal wrote:I can see why now people are atheists
…this is an interesting comment you made. Perhaps this thing you are going through is already starting to help you grow in compassion and understanding of others, that perhaps their ideas are just as valid? It is not what happens to you in life or how you control it that defines you, but how you choose to handle yourself whatever comes your way.
For me, praying for comfort brought floods of peace that showed me who God really is. It’s hard to be angry at Him after the times he’s flooded my spirit with peace that takes away negative emotion and replaces it with peace and comfort. If I was you, I’d reflect on His greatness until you don’t feel angry at him anymore. Visualize the peace that comes from turning your life over to God, from being free of angry etcetera, and give yourself over to it.
Then pray and tell him you acknowlege his greatness, ability to comfort you, and that you’re willing to accept whatever He happens to throw your way — believing He’ll help you get through it.
Get yourself into a deep state of humility and then pray.
You’ll probably feel the Spirit in strong doses and it’ll dull that uncooperativeness you’re feeling with God right now.
Thank you for all of the replies and great advice. I read the scriptures today. I don’t think I will ever believe like a TBM, but I have never read the BOM all the way through, and therefore I do not know to what extent it is, if at all true. I have always had a hard time reading scriptures, but today was different. I took the advice to cut myself off from anything but reading. It wasn’t because it was what I was suppost to do, or to be better, or to fill some need. I read just to read it, no other reason. I don’t think I have ever gotten through a chapter with out having to go back and re-read some part because my mind wandered. This time it was different, and I read through 9 chapters easily. I could have kept going, but I was so tired from the day my eyes were killing me. Now that I have my contacts out I may even read some more if I am not too tired. I also have tried to pray in my heart to my maker for things other than being grateful. I think it is easy for me to offer up gratitude, but other than that it is just strange. I haven’t asked yet what is true, I don’t think I will get an answer, not yet. In the mean time I have taken baby steps. Like heber said the feeling won’t go away, so I should start trying to really work them out. Thanks again for all of the help. As far as the atheist thing goes, I am not sure what I really meant by that. I wrote it at 2 in the morning when I couldn’t sleep. I think at the time I was just feeling like it would be easier to just not think about it. Reading back it sounds a little mean on my part, like the reason people are atheist are because they don’t think about it. I don’t really believe that is always the case. I feel I need answers, if my mom passes away soon I want to know where she goes, or have some vague idea (since I don’t think we can have much more). The pressure seems like it is getting to me, and I think sometimes I just want space from it. brynngal wrote:I am in my 20’s so not very old. I can see why now people are atheists, it seems easier to make peace with no one being there, and figure what happens after death happens, and make peace that you have no idea what that means. I think that if religion wasn’t so entangled in my life I would probably just head that direction.
I hope there’s room for one more piece of advice. I’m also in my 20’s, and been at atheism. Here’s my advice. Stop being scared of atheism. Atheism might work for you, and it might help you for a time. You also might realize it doesn’t work for you. But I find it better to experience this for yourself than to speculate on what it might mean for you. It’s not like you’ll go to hell if you admit that you don’t think God exists, or that you’re even uncertain.There is more than one person on this site (even amongst the admins) who have been atheists at one point in their lives. It doesn’t have to be a final destination. It might be nothing more than a stop along the way. Moreover, I find myself agreeing with many atheists about their views. I can totally understand not believing in God. And, in fact, I might boldly state that I DO NOT KNOW if there is a God. Literally, I don’t know. I can’t prove it, I can’t convince anyone of it, even myself. All I do know is that like hawkgrrrl, I hope there is some sort of energy or intelligence in the universe and it seems I connect to it every once in a while. I’ll call that thing God, and claim I believe.
Also, while I think reading the scriptures is good, I honestly would recommend branching out in your young age. Learn what is out there. Read lots of different books. You might find a world full of people who actually make sense, whose beliefs are reasonable even though they conflict with what you’ve been taught. This builds an appreciation for those around you. I don’t want to belittle the BoM, but despite what our church says, it might be you find more spirituality in the NT, or the Koran, or the Baghavad Gita. Even if you do, you don’t have to convert to any other religion.
Finally, if you don’t want to pray, don’t. Seriously, it’s just not worth feeling bad or guilty about. You don’t have to feel rebellious for not wanting to pray. This is your culture making your feel shame for not doing what you have been led to believe is expected of you.
Quote:I can totally understand not believing in God. And, in fact, I might boldly state that I DO NOT KNOW if there is a God. Literally, I don’t know. I can’t prove it, I can’t convince anyone of it, even myself.
Doesn’t that make you agnostic rather than atheist?
SamBee wrote:Quote:I can totally understand not believing in God. And, in fact, I might boldly state that I DO NOT KNOW if there is a God. Literally, I don’t know. I can’t prove it, I can’t convince anyone of it, even myself.
Doesn’t that make you agnostic rather than atheist?
I didn’t think I ever said I was atheist, did I? I just mentioned I’ve been there before. In any case, as I’ve read what atheists themselves define as atheism I’m left thinking the line is pretty dang fuzzy between the two (seehereIn any case, you gotta finish the quote
Euhemerus wrote:And, in fact, I might boldly state that I DO NOT KNOW if there is a God. Literally, I don’t know. I can’t prove it, I can’t convince anyone of it, even myself. All I do know is that like hawkgrrrl, I hope there is some sort of energy or intelligence in the universe and it seems I connect to it every once in a while. I’ll call that thing God, and claim I believe.
Okay, sorry, taken out of context… A lot of agnostics do think they’re atheist in my experience though. They’re actually quite different. I’ve been agnostic for long periods of my life, but never atheist. Both atheists, and theists encourage the confusion maybe.
I always wanted to set up a Militant Agnostic Movement, kind of like the Skeptics thing. Imagine the chants…
“What do we want?”
“We don’t know!”
“When do we want it?”
“We’re not sure!”
😆 
😆 I agree the line can be fuzzy, but I think hardcore atheists blur the line. It boosts their numbers.
I am a people pleaser, and I feel like I am letting my husband down if I am not at least trying to see for myself if the church is true. It would be nice to take a break, try something else on for a while. I feel a sense of obligation pulling me toward Mormonism, and I find myself just wishing I could receive some sort of confirmation that would leave me never doubting. My husband never doubts, he says he just knows. I know I could never be completely in line with the church, and that is the place my husband is at, but he believes in the BOM. Still I find myself wondering what if I decide it is not true, I thought it would be easy being more culturally a Mormon. I find myself wondering about Gs, if I don’t even believe at least a fraction of it, am I defiling someones very sacred practices? My husband really want me to wear them, even if I don’t know. It seems like everything would be more peaceful if I could just get myself to fall in line. I love the cheer Sam Bee, totally how I feel!
brynngal wrote:It seems like everything would be more peaceful if I could just get myself to fall in line.
brynngal, I think it is a good thing you care enough about your husband to want that. And many can let that be enough reason to choose spouse over something like G’s or whatever. That may be one option, a perfectly valid option. But it needs to be your choice, and something you can honestly feel you can do, or else it will just surface later as a grudge, and become a wedge in the relationship. I am not saying you can or you can’t, it depends on how strongly you feel about things and what you can choose to live with…to me, that is what relationships are about. If you love the other person enough, you can choose to accept things and become more like them, or you can choose to express to them you honestly can’t accept those things and work out the differences in a way that let’s the 2 of you understand each other.All things may not make perfect sense, but you can choose your love and love your choice, despite paradoxes or mysteries, and keep focused on what makes you happy in your life, and pass on the rest of the stuff in the cafeteria line. You seem like a real honest and sweet person. Your disposition may be one of your greatest talents in handling this.
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